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Fuckyouformakingmeregister
wall candy eating retard
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ephekt View Post
Gore certainly stands to make millions. The scientists probably have grant money up for grabs as well.

Gore is going to make millions on carbon tax?

All scientists who support human-induced global warming are doing so because of the money?

There's a giant science conspiracy?!?

The UN only wants to make money?!?

--------------------------------------------------------

Do you really believe these things?

Quote:
Indeed. There is plenty of correlation between Co2 levels and warming, but no causation. The evangelists would have us take their extrapolations and computer models (rather than historical temperature records) as fact, which is pure BS.
I'll ask again: What sort of evidence are you looking for? It's a fact that CO2 is a greenhouse gas. It's a fact that humans can produce it. It's a fact that temperatures have increased alongside an increase in human carbon-producing activities. It's a fact that when factors other than CO2 are controlled, temperatures are still seen as rising. It's a fact that the relevant rise in CO2 preceded the relevant temperature rise.

Are there other sorts of things you want to see before causation conclusions are made? If so, what?

Last edited by Fuckyouformakingmeregister; 05-12-2008 at 04:58 PM..
Old 05-12-2008, 04:54 PM Fuckyouformakingmeregister is offline  
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ephekt
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuckyouformakingmeregister View Post
Gore is going to make millions on carbon tax?
Are you retarded? Gore has investment companies poised to eat up this lefty communist carbon trading nonsense. GIM has influence over Chicago Climate Exchange (CCX) in the U.S. and the Carbon Neutral Company (CNC) in the UK, both carbon offset scammers.

Also, Gore has already made millions off the AGW junk. http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=3281925

Quote:
All scientists who support human-induced global warming are doing so because of the money?
Absolutely not what I said. Stop making strawmen. I said the scientists probably stood to gain grant funding. I have no doubt that the scientists are just riding this bit of junk science out like so many before.

Quote:
I'll ask again: What sort of evidence are you looking for? It's a fact that CO2 is a greenhouse gas. It's a fact that humans can produce it. It's a fact that temperatures have increased alongside an increase in human carbon-producing activities. It's a fact that when factors other than CO2 are controlled, temperatures are still seen as rising. It's a fact that the relevant rise in CO2 preceded the relevant temperature rise.
Explain the periods of cooling. Explain why the warming is correlated with the sun heating up, etc.

It gets warmer, global warming is to blame!
It gets colder; global warming is to blame!
The climate stays the same, global warming is at play!

You AGW tards are colossal morons.
Old 05-12-2008, 05:36 PM ephekt is offline  
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Fuckyouformakingmeregister
wall candy eating retard
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ephekt View Post
Are you retarded? Gore has investment companies poised to eat up this lefty communist carbon trading nonsense. GIM has influence over Chicago Climate Exchange (CCX) in the U.S. and the Carbon Neutral Company (CNC) in the UK, both carbon offset scammers.

Also, Gore has already made millions off the AGW junk. http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=3281925

Even if we granted this nonsense about Gore making millions off carbon taxes (note that i said carbon TAX not carbon credits - i.e.:government revenue not company revenue), I fail to see how that supports the "global warming is bunk" bandwagon.

If anyone has something to gain from what they say, we can't trust them? In which case I guess we can't trust the global warming skeptics who would sell lots of books, get lots of grants and become super famous if people accepted their arguments. Guess we should also throw out any arguments made by scientists or writers associated with energy companies because they clearly have something to gain from denying warming too.

In fact, why listen to anybody? Scientists are only out to get grants, writers are only out to get famous, the media just wants your attention, etc.

Quote:
Absolutely not what I said. Stop making strawmen. I said the scientists probably stood to gain grant funding. I have no doubt that the scientists are just riding this bit of junk science out like so many before.
You didn't say it directly but you certainly alluded to it. If you want to clear the air, answer the following: Are scientists who support the IPCC's conclusions doing so primarily for money or job security?

Quote:
Explain the periods of cooling. Explain why the warming is correlated with the sun heating up, etc.
Regarding the first, scientists believe that Milankovitch cycles probably played a role. An increase in the number of carbon-fixing plants might also account for some cooling.

Regarding the second, there isn't a correlation for the recently observed warming and solar radiation as demonstrated in a paper (note this is an actual scientific paper and not a wiki or an opinion piece) by Lockwood and Frohlich (2007) (linked here). (At the very least, read the abstract)

Also, don't forget what I said earlier (paraphrasing the IPCC):
- if solar radiation were the cause of current warming, you'd expect temperature changes at different latitudes to be the same
(they aren't: northern latitudes are heating up faster)

- if solar radiation were the cause of current warming, you'd expect the number of warm nights to stay relatively constant
(they aren't: the number of warm nights is increasing)

Last edited by Fuckyouformakingmeregister; 05-12-2008 at 09:40 PM..
Old 05-12-2008, 09:34 PM Fuckyouformakingmeregister is offline  
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ephekt
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuckyouformakingmeregister View Post
Even if we granted this nonsense about Gore making millions off carbon taxes (note that i said carbon TAX not carbon credits - i.e.:government revenue not company revenue)
Please note that I didn't mention TAX in my post, so your argument is misplaced (or simply a strawman).

Quote:
Scientists are only out to get grants
Another strawman.

Quote:
Are scientists who support the IPCC's conclusions doing so primarily for money or job security?
This is such an obviously loaded question...

I DO NOT mean to imply that scientists are part of some conspiracy. However, there is certainly pressure to be peer-reviewed favorably and keep grant money. I wouldn't say ALL scientists are pursuing AGW for this reason, but they're certainly out there.




Quote:
Also, don't forget what I said earlier (paraphrasing the IPCC):
- if solar radiation were the cause of current warming, you'd expect temperature changes at different latitudes to be the same
(they aren't: northern latitudes are heating up faster)

- if solar radiation were the cause of current warming, you'd expect the number of warm nights to stay relatively constant
(they aren't: the number of warm nights is increasing)
http://www.space.com/scienceastronom...ut_030320.html
Quote:
In what could be the simplest explanation for one component of global warming, a new study shows the Sun's radiation has increased by .05 percent per decade since the late 1970s.

The increase would only be significant to Earth's climate if it has been going on for a century or more, said study leader Richard Willson, a Columbia University researcher also affiliated with NASA's Goddard Institute for Space Studies.

The Sun's increasing output has only been monitored with precision since satellite technology allowed necessary observations. Willson is not sure if the trend extends further back in time, but other studies suggest it does.

"This trend is important because, if sustained over many decades, it could cause significant climate change," Willson said.

In a NASA-funded study recently published in Geophysical Research Letters, Willson and his colleagues speculate on the possible history of the trend based on data collected in the pre-satellite era.

"Solar activity has apparently been going upward for a century or more," Willson told SPACE.com today.
Old 05-12-2008, 10:03 PM ephekt is offline  
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#439  

jkrowling
 
freewilly and morlock are the only ones who have had a worthwhile exchange...

in the meanwhile, the future (either/any of the possible) presidents of the united states of america has gone ahead and made the decision for all of you worthless shit-eating monkies...

+ YouTube Video
ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.


har har har har har...
Old 05-12-2008, 11:07 PM jkrowling is offline  
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#440  

Fuckyouformakingmeregister
wall candy eating retard
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ephekt View Post
Please note that I didn't mention TAX in my post, so your argument is misplaced (or simply a strawman).

Since you answered a question regarding a carbon TAX with "are you a retard, blah blah, Al Gore making millions, blah blah", my argument sure as shit isn't misplaced. Gore isn't going to make money off a carbon TAX, end of story.

Quote:
Another strawman.
Look, I know you apparently like the word strawman, but how about you read the entire argument before commenting?

You're essentially saying that we can't trust Al Gore and other scientists because they have something to gain. I said everyone involved has something gain, so why trust anybody. Prove me wrong or concede my point.

Quote:
This is such an obviously loaded question...

I DO NOT mean to imply that scientists are part of some conspiracy. However, there is certainly pressure to be peer-reviewed favorably and keep grant money. I wouldn't say ALL scientists are pursuing AGW for this reason, but they're certainly out there.
Since you intially began this exchange by making such broad implications, I'll take this as you now rejecting the argument that we can't trust the IPCC because all the scientists involved have something to gain.

Let me get this straight...in response to the 2007 scientific paper mentioning how solar radiation doesn't account for recent warming you post a 2003 popular science article? This is supposed to somehow refute it?
Old 05-13-2008, 07:42 AM Fuckyouformakingmeregister is offline  
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#441  

BigFuzzyArchon
 
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kg-6gn2MAw4

It is clear Al Gore is trying to push his own agenda and its not actually about saving the earth. Wake the fuck up. Not saying global warming isn't real, just that this guy is wrong.
Old 05-13-2008, 09:42 AM BigFuzzyArchon is offline  
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#442  

Badger_sly
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ephekt View Post
Gore certainly stands to make millions. The scientists probably have grant money up for grabs as well.
The scientists promoting the fad of "man-made" global warming most definitely have grant money up for grabs. That's how they fund their jobs, by outputting junk science. Unfortunately the media has promoted that to new levels. As someone else said, Gore's movie is a perfect example.

Quote:
The evangelists would have us take their extrapolations and computer models (rather than historical temperature records) as fact, which is pure BS.
And even their guesses and models have been proven corrupted/false, and attempts made at coverup.
Old 05-16-2008, 01:28 PM Badger_sly is offline  
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#443  

Badger_sly
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuckyouformakingmeregister View Post
The fact that temperatures have fluctuated "on their own" in the past is not proof that humans have no impact on global temperature. Rather, it's proof that non-human factors can impact global temperature. And the IPCC fully admits that other factors CAN impact global temperature. After controlling such factors, however, the IPCC believes that CURRENT warming is attributable to human activity.
Unfortunatey for the IPCC though, their data has been proven corrupt.
Old 05-16-2008, 01:30 PM Badger_sly is offline  
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Badger_sly
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuckyouformakingmeregister View Post
It's
NOT
Quote:
a fact that temperatures have increased alongside an increase in human carbon-producing activities.
Old 05-16-2008, 01:35 PM Badger_sly is offline  
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#445  

BigFuzzyArchon
 
 
global warming does not cause hurricanes to appear more frequently. it actually does the opposite.
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5j...cZSAQD90O62QO0

hellooo! why cant you guy figure out that basically all we know is that the temperature has gone up. Anything beyond that is speculation.
Old 05-19-2008, 10:48 AM BigFuzzyArchon is offline  
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Badger_sly
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigFuzzyArchon View Post
global warming does not cause hurricanes to appear more frequently. it actually does the opposite.
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5j...cZSAQD90O62QO0

hellooo! why cant you guy figure out that basically all we know is that the temperature has gone up. Anything beyond that is speculation.

Ah, you beat me to it! Oh well. I was going to add this photo, though:

Old 05-19-2008, 11:26 AM Badger_sly is offline  
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#447  

Escaped Gorilla Genitals
Jim Morrison
Hey, Jim <3 ules, You didn't deserve this because you can't guess numbers but anyways BREAK ON TH
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigFuzzyArchon View Post
global warming does not cause hurricanes to appear more frequently. it actually does the opposite.
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5j...cZSAQD90O62QO0

hellooo! why cant you guy figure out that basically all we know is that the temperature has gone up. Anything beyond that is speculation.
It does however increase the intensity of those that do make landfall. And yes everything is speculation. That doesn't change the fact that the vast majority of scientists and scientific institutions agree that anthropogenic climate change is real. There have been lots of models and estimates about how the climate will change and of course many of them have been wrong. This does not warrant dismissal of all the current evidence of anthropogenic climate change to "Oh well we really don't know anything", that's just stupid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigFuzzyArchon View Post
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kg-6gn2MAw4

It is clear Al Gore is trying to push his own agenda and its not actually about saving the earth. Wake the fuck up. Not saying global warming isn't real, just that this guy is wrong.
Yes, Gore is clearly trying to push an agenda, creating awareness about climate change. However he's not the one putting words in peoples mouths like Fox News does here. More intense hurricanes are a prediction of global warming which is probably what Gore was referring to. In fact he straight up says in the actual interview “any individual storm can’t be linked singularly to global warming – we’ve always had hurricanes.” So no, Gore is not wrong according to your own article you just posted.
http://thinkprogress.org/wonkroom/20...-gore-cyclone/

It's funny how demonized Gore has become by people like yourself and Fox News when he's done little more than be a public face for the concerns of the vast majority of the scientific community.
Old 05-19-2008, 12:02 PM Escaped Gorilla Genitals is offline  
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#448  

Escaped Gorilla Genitals
Jim Morrison
Hey, Jim <3 ules, You didn't deserve this because you can't guess numbers but anyways BREAK ON TH
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badger_sly View Post
The scientists promoting the fad of "man-made" global warming most definitely have grant money up for grabs. That's how they fund their jobs, by outputting junk science. Unfortunately the media has promoted that to new levels. As someone else said, Gore's movie is a perfect example.
lol. Fad of man made global warming? It wasn't a fad decades ago when the majority of scientists where still skeptical about anthropogenic global warming and those that did where a distinct and media shunned minority. It wasn't a fad or bags of money that convinced the scientific community that anthropogenic global warming was real, it was the increasing amount of evidence from studies that eventually became too overwhelming for most scientists to deny. But keep trotting out old and refuted evidence like you're proving anything and that the vast majority of scientists haven't already seen your arguments and "evidence", you're like the morons who try to deny human evolution by trotting out Piltdown man or what have you.
Old 05-19-2008, 12:19 PM Escaped Gorilla Genitals is offline  
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#449  

Badger_sly
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Morrison View Post
lol. Fad of man made global warming? It wasn't a fad decades ago when the majority of scientists where still skeptical about anthropogenic global warming and those that did where a distinct and media shunned minority. It wasn't a fad or bags of money that convinced the scientific community that anthropogenic global warming was real, it was the increasing amount of evidence from studies that eventually became too overwhelming for most scientists to deny. But keep trotting out old and refuted evidence like you're proving anything and that the vast majority of scientists haven't already seen your arguments and "evidence", you're like the morons who try to deny human evolution by trotting out Piltdown man or what have you.

It was a fad also decades ago when they "predicted" / made a fuss about a new coming ice age.

It's ok if you caught in the fad with the other simpletons. You're fall off the bandwagon eventually and realize how rediculous you sounded. And nice try pretending you're discrediting the provided proof with nothing more than your brainwashed opinion. Of course we know that is typical of you.
Old 05-19-2008, 01:30 PM Badger_sly is offline  
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