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s0me0nesmind1
 
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Originally Posted by pyramid View Post
The gay thing is still a legitimate issue but on one side you have people saying "in a free country like ours, where people are considered equal in the eyes of the law, our laws and rights should apply to everyone equally." and on the other side you have people saying that religion owns the rights to marriage, we should continue discriminating because the bible says so and gay people make us feel icky and if gay people get married it will be the downfall of all western civilization...

The gay thing points right back to religion. It's retarded biggots saying that Christianity says it's wrong, thus we can't have it. Except that obviously tosses religion into play, which as you already said, is stupid as fuck to bring into politics. Did marriage untimately come from Christianity? I don't know, nor do I care.

Also, nothing was "settled" it's still alive and kicking in the political world / mainstream media today - so I REALLY hope you don't mean that it never comes up in politics / court / wasted time and tax dollars.
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Old 05-17-2012, 08:25 PM s0me0nesmind1 is offline  
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Weed is completely a liberal want.

http://reason.com/blog/2012/05/16/po...ns-including-6

Quote:
Support for keeping the federal government out of state medical marijuana issues was universal across all demographics. With respect to political affiliation, 75% of Democrats, 67% of Republicans, and, notably 79% of Independents said that President Obama should respect state medical marijuana laws.
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Old 05-17-2012, 08:29 PM pyramid is offline  
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If you try and talk about taxes you have one side saying "Hey, maybe we should raise the top marginal rate by 3% and tax capital gains of over a million dollars at 30% to make up for at least some of our budget deficit" and on the other side you have people saying no, we should decimate all socials services, cut more taxes on the rich, raise taxes on the poor (commonly referred to as "broadening the tax base"), dig the hole we are already in even deeper even faster and those other idiots who want to raise taxes slightly are all socialist communist fascist maoist america hating assholes who just want to see the country fail...

Also, "not failing as a country" is not a "right wing" issue. It's a right wing meme that liberals want america to fail. That is not a real issue, that is retarded hyperbolic rhetoric. Anytime someone says everyone who disagrees with them just wants the country to fail, that should be your cue that they are an idiot spewing hyperbole and you should probably find something else to listen to.

Seriously have no idea what you are insinuating here

"Conservatives" in general do NOT have some kind of side where they think rich people should be taxed less. Just because a moronic Bush came up with the "trickle down" s doesn't equate to republicans want less tax on the rich. I really don't wanna have to pull out the graphs showing that the top 10% pay for 80%+ of taxes again - it's old and I can't understand why people don't realize it

Conservatives just want everyone who takes advantage of all the government services like the ability to walk into a hospital and get cared for with a bill of $0 to pay the same rate that we all do. How many times have you talked with people in your life that work hard hours and a tough job that get paid shit because they don't have rare skills. Ask them if they like the taxes they are charged. Now realize that alone should tell you why this whole 1% crap is stupid as fuck.

Closing loopholes is something both sides should be for, but I don't even have the slightest clue why makers of the law can't study law apparently
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Old 05-17-2012, 08:31 PM s0me0nesmind1 is offline  
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Poll: 74 Percent of Americans, Including 67 Percent of Republicans, Want Obama to End Medical Marijuana Crackdown
Holy FUCK are you retarded? The FUCKING TITLE of the Article itself explains how fucking RETARDED you are .

A fucking marijuana crackdown. What does that equate to? GOVERNMENT SPENDING. As if Liberals don't do enough of it Jesus fuck I hope you are in special school
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Old 05-17-2012, 08:33 PM s0me0nesmind1 is offline  
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Yeah, I still don't understand how doctors and health insurance don't help make you healthy?

He is arguing for the personal responsibility side of things, which is valid as you do need to keep yourself healthy in your personal choices. Doctors only fix things when they go wrong or you do a shitty job of keeping yourself healthy and insurance just pays for it.
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Old 05-17-2012, 08:38 PM pyramid is offline  
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Seriously have no idea what you are insinuating here

"Conservatives" in general do NOT have some kind of side where they think rich people should be taxed less. Just because a moronic Bush came up with the "trickle down" s doesn't equate to republicans want less tax on the rich. I really don't wanna have to pull out the graphs showing that the top 10% pay for 80%+ of taxes again - it's old and I can't understand why people don't realize it

Reagan's crew came up with "trickle down", not Bush. And the Ryan Budget, which republicans are pushing for, has further tax cuts for the rich.

The top 10% pay 80% of the taxes because they collect 80% of the income and control 80% of the wealth.

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Conservatives just want everyone who takes advantage of all the government services like the ability to walk into a hospital and get cared for with a bill of $0 to pay the same rate that we all do.
That's not a government service. The government just demands that people get emergency treatment regardless of ability to pay because that's the only decent way to run a health care system. Everyone who buys health insurance eats the cost of people who walk out on their emergency room bills. That's why we want universal coverage and why it will reduce costs. The mandate is certainly not my first choice for accomplishing that but if it manages to get everyone participating in the system then I guess it is a necessary evil.

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How many times have you talked with people in your life that work hard hours and a tough job that get paid shit because they don't have rare skills. Ask them if they like the taxes they are charged. Now realize that alone should tell you why this whole 1% crap is stupid as fuck.
50% of the country doesn't pay federal income taxes because they don't even earn enough to qualify but thanks to the federal budget deficits, states have been getting less money back from the feds and so have been raising their own rates to compensate.

If the 1% absorbs 90+% of all new wealth creation, how long to you think someone in that position is going to be waiting for a raise? Hint: They've been waiting 30 years already....

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/stran...3#.T7W550VSS5I

Those "taxes" they are complaining about paying is their retirement fund. AKA Social Security. And if the current republicans in congress get their way, that worker you are talking about will never even get that back.

Quote:
Closing loopholes is something both sides should be for, but I don't even have the slightest clue why makers of the law can't study law apparently
"closing loopholes" is a great buzz word but when it comes down to specifics no one wants to actually do anything.
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Old 05-17-2012, 08:58 PM pyramid is offline  
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Holy FUCK are you retarded? The FUCKING TITLE of the Article itself explains how fucking RETARDED you are .

A fucking marijuana crackdown. What does that equate to? GOVERNMENT SPENDING. As if Liberals don't do enough of it Jesus fuck I hope you are in special school

YOU said it was a completely liberal issue.
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Old 05-17-2012, 08:59 PM pyramid is offline  
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"Conservatives" in general do NOT have some kind of side where they think rich people should be taxed less. Just because a moronic Bush came up with the "trickle down" s doesn't equate to republicans want less tax on the rich.


the fact that you think bush came up with "trickle down" shows just how woefully uninformed you are in your opinions. go learn something about politics in this country from the past half century and then you'll be allowed to discuss the issue with the grown ups
Old 05-17-2012, 08:59 PM SemperFly is offline  
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"closing loopholes" is a great buzz word but when it comes down to specifics no one wants to actually do anything.

All the dumbfucks who signed Grover Norquist's "No New Taxes" pledge consider closing loopholes to be raising taxes. They're not quite clear if it would be ok along with lowering rates.


Closing loopholes would be a good step to equalize the tax code between the rich and poor. Lots of use could lower our tax bill, but we don't have the time to do it ourselves and it's not worth enough money to hire somebody. The rich, well...it's worth it for them. Close the loopholes and their effective rates will go up more.
Old 05-17-2012, 09:16 PM Gibonius is offline  
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He is arguing for the personal responsibility side of things, which is valid as you do need to keep yourself healthy in your personal choices. Doctors only fix things when they go wrong or you do a shitty job of keeping yourself healthy and insurance just pays for it.

Yes, but doctors play a major role in helping you make good personal choices (and health insurance helps pay, as you said). Obviously having a doctor doesn't automatically make you healthy, but ignoring he major role doctors/medical care/health insurance play on your health is fucking dumb. Even if health is ultimately determined by personal choice (which isn't even really true), that's not a good reason to oppose UHC
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Old 05-17-2012, 09:32 PM 5ive is offline  
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Yeah, I still don't understand how doctors and health insurance don't help make you healthy?


Doctors will try to either fix or minimize/mask symptoms of the problem you told them about. Sometimes more than one problem or they notice more problems. Most adults have hundreds of problems. No one goes to the doctor and comes out healthy from some magic pill they were given.
Old 05-17-2012, 11:03 PM edplayer is offline  
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edplayer
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Yes, but doctors play a major role in helping you make good personal choices (and health insurance helps pay, as you said).


That could be possible but that is different than what we were arguing about previously, that doctors make you healthy.


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Obviously having a doctor doesn't automatically make you healthy, but ignoring he major role doctors/medical care/health insurance play on your health is fucking dumb. Even if health is ultimately determined by personal choice (which isn't even really true), that's not a good reason to oppose UHC


No, you don't know what you are talking about. They play a very minor role. It is primarily (though not fully) determined by personal choices and actions.
Old 05-17-2012, 11:07 PM edplayer is offline  
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Originally Posted by s0me0nesmind1 View Post
The term conservative/republican these days are associated way too much with ...

All most liberals EVER think about is shit that shouldn't even matter in politics


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Originally Posted by s0me0nesmind1 View Post
Weed is completely a liberal want.


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Originally Posted by s0me0nesmind1 View Post
"Conservatives" in general ...

Conservatives just want...


You should state what you think a conservative is and what a liberal is.

Last edited by edplayer; 05-17-2012 at 11:26 PM..
Old 05-17-2012, 11:14 PM edplayer is offline  
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Vote McCain!
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You should state what you think a conservative is and what a liberal is.

Those terms are malleable; you can make them mean whatever you want them to mean.
Old 05-18-2012, 02:08 PM Vote McCain! is offline  
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edplayer
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Those terms are malleable; you can make them mean whatever you want them to mean.



That is why I asked him. To me, if people are arguing and they don't even agree on what the terms they are using mean (without the other's knowledge) then they are not talking about the same thing. Why even bother?
Old 05-18-2012, 02:15 PM edplayer is offline  
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