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JPF_
 
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Originally Posted by Tex Arcana View Post
Mustangs can nearly double the power with turbos; dunno about Cameros, but what I've seen isn't nearly that much, maybe 1/3-2/3 more; and dodges can't do shit because they can't unlock the ECU.

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Old 01-19-2013, 08:03 PM JPF_ is offline  
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JPF_
 
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Originally Posted by gribly View Post
Proof of 750hp with only, and ONLY a boost controller or you're full of shit. Hyundai? C'mon, have some class.

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Just saying, I do not think getting 750hp outta that bmw will be hard....
Old 01-19-2013, 08:11 PM JPF_ is offline  
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Tex Arcana
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Originally Posted by Jehannum View Post
Surely it's possible to meet "noise regulations" and use a good filter while not sacrificing 10-15% of available horsepower. Unless Ford hires fucking monkeys to design their cars (though given the looks of the Mustang, my suspicion is that they do).

Considering they have considerable more brain and computing power than you have, plus they've done the research and testing for far longer than you, me and half this forum have been alive put together, I'm guessing they know a fair bit more about this (and a few other subjects) than you do.
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Old 01-19-2013, 09:12 PM Tex Arcana is offline  
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Now if you are done stroking your frankfurter over the roundel, can we get back to the G8 this fucking thread was originally about?

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Old 01-19-2013, 09:18 PM Tex Arcana is offline  
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I stand corrected.
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Old 01-19-2013, 09:19 PM Tex Arcana is offline  
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Tex Arcana
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Originally Posted by gribly View Post
Proof of 750hp with only, and ONLY a boost controller or you're full of shit. Hyundai? C'mon, have some class.

Who needs a fucking boost controller??



Ghoddamn roundel-ricers...
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Old 01-19-2013, 09:23 PM Tex Arcana is offline  
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lollersk8s
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Originally Posted by DopefishLives View Post
The idea that Exhibit A is better than Exhibit B is heavily subjective. My car is better than a 5-series because it costs half as much while making more power. While my car is better for me than a 5-series could ever hope to be, I'm open to the fact that current or future 5-series owners may not feel a G8 is better than a 5-series for them.



This is what pisses off Gribly, as well as me. I am a facts person and when some asshat comes out to the masses spreading 'facts' that are anything but, I get annoyed. Details change an argument completely and it is convenient to lack them when you want to sell horseshit to a farmer as gold.

It is safe to assume that 'a boost controller' will not be on their mod sheet as most modern cars in the last 20 years (BMW and Audi in particular) control these systems to great accuracy via the ECU. Any changes to boost pressure can be made electronically without a secondary mechanical or electrical control module. Further proof that you speak wholly from your asshole for nothing more than the sake of doing so.

Manhart's own website is quite vague, failing to outline ANY modifications or details on their 'tuning packages'. Those interested in what it takes to make 750 brake horse power are given nothing more than, "Further information and price on request."

So far the highest numbers out of Manhart with a 'ECU program-only' change is 620bhp. Respectable for sure, but not unheard of out of a moderate displacement, forced-induction V8. I think it is fair to say we all get excited about numbers like that and find it quite keen, but to say it is the best and brightest of any internal combustion engine to date and that all should begin their bowing now is a bit of a stretch. Fair to note, Manhart's base price for a 'Stage 1 ECU Reprogram' is roughly $5,000USD. Moving on...

The only '750HP' Manhart car I've been able to find any details on is their MH3 Clubsport. This car has an engine conversion, swapping in the S63 twin-turbo V8 of which this hot bed discussion is all about. Sweet way to get 620bhp off of my earlier findings and I'm sure a costly one, but that is irrelevant in this discussion. We know the base ECU programming is $5,000, but to get to 750bhp it is going to take a little more. The MH3 uses a larger intercoolers and heat-exchangers, larger radiator and additional an additional oil cooler. Uprated pistons and rods and a full exhaust system are also a part of reaching 750bhp on this model. A fair fucking bit more than just 'a boost controller'.

Now if you are done stroking your frankfurter over the roundel, can we get back to the G8 this fucking thread was originally about?

Sources:
http://www.manhart-racing.de/english...ine-tuning.php

http://f10.m5post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=758613

http://bmwmcars.net/manhart-mh3-v8-r...t-with-750-hp/


Speaking of getting annoyed, you seem like the type of person who corrects others when they call three of something a "couple" so let me spell it out for you - yes I know these cars require a tune, like any other turbo car ever with fuel injection along with larger injectors and a better pump and a larger radiator and intercooler etc - thanks for this ground breaking information.

Anyway you're so confused you're confusing me now. I was talking about the F10 M5, but threw the E90 M3 in there too for shits and gigs (guess I shouldn't have).

MH3 = M3, factory naturally aspirated, so yes they swap pistons to lower CR for boost, and in one of your links they swapped in an X6M motor. Which made 750 hp.

MH5 = F10 M5, factory twin turbo, they advertise a package with 750 hp on their website - no swap required (turbo engine is already in there) just the supporting mods + larger turbo as far as I can tell and you haven't proved me wrong either.




.....but yes the G8, a good value for the money and I'd rather have that than a lot of other cars. So well done.
Old 01-20-2013, 02:02 AM lollersk8s is offline  
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Jehannum
 
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Originally Posted by DopefishLives View Post
I don't see many people complaining about a car that delivers 415bhp for $30,000. The fact that a ~200$ modification nets another 20hp over stock seems like a win for any owner. It isn't about them being idiots, engineering is the art of compromise and it isn't always as simple as 'lets wring as much as we can out of this motor so that this looks really awesome on our website'. Other variables beyond just 'moar power' and core engineering are at play and all manufacturers face that same challenge.

The 'first-run' Pontiac G8's had an air intake design identical to the Camaro, which was smoother and allowed for improved airflow and possibly more induction noise. The actual production models that were sold were fitted with an intake assembly similar to the old fourth-generation F-Body, which lowered engine output and likely noise as well as added clutter to the engine bay. This sounds like a bad move, but the reality is that there was likely pressure on the Pontiac/Holden engineers to dial the car back a bit so that it didn't press to hard against the Chevy offerings. This is an example of marketing enforcing compromise on design so as to differentiate markets or models. I'm not saying these sorts of things are right, but it does happen and it isn't only GM suffering from such business .

Let me know when you are an actual engineer. If I (actual engineer here) turned in a project that left a full 15% performance on the table, I'd be fired, and rightly so.
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Old 01-20-2013, 06:23 AM Jehannum is offline  
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Or perhaps it's the fact 99.99% of people buy a car for transportation purposes only you fucking inbred hilljack

Those people buy Camrys and V6 Mustangs, fatass.
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Old 01-20-2013, 06:25 AM Jehannum is offline  
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Rancidpunk666
 
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Those people buy Camrys and V6 Mustangs, fatass.

So no one wants a fast car that is quiet? Fucking hell get your head out of your sisters vagina you inbred piece of shit
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Old 01-20-2013, 06:28 AM Rancidpunk666 is offline  
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Jehannum
 
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Originally Posted by Tex Arcana View Post
Considering they have considerable more brain and computing power than you have, plus they've done the research and testing for far longer than you, me and half this forum have been alive put together, I'm guessing they know a fair bit more about this (and a few other subjects) than you do.

I sincerely doubt that they have more computing power than me. I have an account on Titan.

The rest is debatable, as I have a background in operational testing and product development. Go look for your chin somewhere else.
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1971 240Z: Toyota front brakes, 123 RWHP
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Old 01-20-2013, 06:28 AM Jehannum is offline  
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Jehannum
 
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Originally Posted by Rancidpunk666 View Post
So no one wants a fast car that is quiet? Fucking hell get your head out of your sisters vagina you inbred piece of shit

Oh please, the very first thing a V8 Mustang owner does is change out exhaust for a fucking flowmaster 40 setup. Get your jowly mug out of the sand.
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1971 240Z: Toyota front brakes, 123 RWHP
1967 Pontiac GTO: not stock.
Old 01-20-2013, 06:31 AM Jehannum is offline  
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Oh please, the very first thing a V8 Mustang owner does is change out exhaust for a fucking flowmaster 40 setup. Get your jowly mug out of the sand.

I can guarantee you only a very small percentage of owners do that, like less than 10%
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Old 01-20-2013, 06:33 AM Rancidpunk666 is offline  
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Jehannum
 
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I can guarantee you only a very small percentage of owners do that, like less than 10%

Only if you consider them as a percentage of total mustang sales ( including V6). Besides, a CAI doesn't increase noise to the extent you're implying.
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1971 240Z: Toyota front brakes, 123 RWHP
1967 Pontiac GTO: not stock.
Old 01-20-2013, 06:37 AM Jehannum is offline  
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Only if you consider them as a percentage of total mustang sales ( including V6). Besides, a CAI doesn't increase noise to the extent you're implying.

Fucking how stupid are? Where did I say anything about a cold air intake?


And no you are wrong even with v8s only a very small percentage of people are going to mod their cars
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Old 01-20-2013, 06:40 AM Rancidpunk666 is offline  
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