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huxley
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So you're saying he was a puppet and you respect him for it, not me.
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Old 04-18-2010, 09:14 AM huxley is offline  
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Straw Man
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Originally Posted by joemama View Post
Were you in diapers in the early 90's and completely unaware of what was going down in the region in the years since the gulf war? As already mentioned in this thread, the gulf war of 91 didn't end with an occupation of victorious forces or a treaty of any kind...simply a cease fire and heavy UN sanctions on Iraq that were essentially enforced by the US/UK since none of the other coalition countries had the military capability to maintain this for years on end. Fighter jets enforcing the UN mandated "no fly zone" were regularly painted by Iraqi anti-aircraft and even fired on frequently, along with occasional artillery fire across the border...and such incidents were increasing leading up to Saddam kicking out the UN weapons inspector in 03.

Unless I was asleep or too busy playing with hotwheels and barbie dolls during this period...I don't recall anything similar with Iran, Uganda, Zimbabwe or North Korea. That would make the Iraq thing a little special wouldn't it?

Actually, the korean war technically never ended, just for curiositys sake. Considering they're talking about nuking shit up and all that other jibberjabber, you'd think it'd be of real interest!
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Old 04-18-2010, 02:29 PM Straw Man is offline  
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joemama
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Actually, the korean war technically never ended, just for curiositys sake. Considering they're talking about nuking shit up and all that other jibberjabber, you'd think it'd be of real interest!
Are you talking about North Korea? Kim Jong may be batshit crazy but everyone knows that his game is based on using his nukes as bargaining chips to get whatever he wants from countries that aren't led by batshit dictators. You know, like food and stuff for the people? All that military shit doesn't pay for itself and North Korea doesn't exactly have a booming economy to pay for it..

edit- in other words, of all the rogue countries that have nukes...NK is the least likely to actually use them. Pakistan has the #1 spot and I don't see that changing any time soon
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Old 04-18-2010, 03:58 PM joemama is offline  
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Originally Posted by joemama View Post
Are you talking about North Korea? Kim Jong may be batshit crazy but everyone knows that his game is based on using his nukes as bargaining chips to get whatever he wants from countries that aren't led by batshit dictators. You know, like food and stuff for the people? All that military shit doesn't pay for itself and North Korea doesn't exactly have a booming economy to pay for it..

edit- in other words, of all the rogue countries that have nukes...NK is the least likely to actually use them. Pakistan has the #1 spot and I don't see that changing any time soon

Yes and Saddam was a threat to world peace, right?
Which reminds me, why was Iraq gangbanged with bitches talkin' bout some uranium while Saddamn denied the entire thing, and NK is at least according to their own admission, trying really hard to fucking get it?
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Old 04-18-2010, 05:15 PM Straw Man is offline  
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joemama
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Yes and Saddam was a threat to world peace, right?
Which reminds me, why was Iraq gangbanged with bitches talkin' bout some uranium while Saddamn denied the entire thing, and NK is at least according to their own admission, trying really hard to fucking get it?
Like I already said in this thread, (you either didn't see it or chose to ignore it) I am NOT making a statement about the rightness or wrongness of the invasion...simply trying to explain to boneheads why my statement "invasion (or something) of Iraq was inevitable at some point.

edit- yes Saddam was a threat to region which usually translates to threat to world peace. if they could keep their retardation contained to that little area of the world full of sand, camels and buttsniffers then I would say have at it and call us when you're done. Doesn't really work that way in the real world however..
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Old 04-18-2010, 06:17 PM joemama is offline  
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Like I already said in this thread, (you either didn't see it or chose to ignore it) I am NOT making a statement about the rightness or wrongness of the invasion...simply trying to explain to boneheads why my statement "invasion (or something) of Iraq was inevitable at some point.

edit- yes Saddam was a threat to region which usually translates to threat to world peace. if they could keep their retardation contained to that little area of the world full of sand, camels and buttsniffers then I would say have at it and call us when you're done. Doesn't really work that way in the real world however..

Of course you're not making a statement. You're just making excuses that aren't valid. I guess there is a difference.
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Old 04-19-2010, 05:30 AM Straw Man is offline  
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joemama
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Of course you're not making a statement. You're just making excuses that aren't valid. I guess there is a difference.
Excuses for what?

I think your judgement is clouded by the title of this thread...which really has nothing to do with what I posted.
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Old 04-19-2010, 09:42 PM joemama is offline  
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Excuses for what?

I think your judgement is clouded by the title of this thread...which really has nothing to do with what I posted.

No, you're saying Iraq and Saddam were somehow special. It's not. You're using reasoning that isn't valid, and/or applies to NK aswell. That sir, is an excuse! GOOD DAY SIR!
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Old 04-20-2010, 02:25 AM Straw Man is offline  
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joemama
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No, you're saying Iraq and Saddam were somehow special. It's not. You're using reasoning that isn't valid, and/or applies to NK aswell. That sir, is an excuse! GOOD DAY SIR!
Ok, lets see..

1. Had a long war with a neighboring country in the past 25 years
2. Invaded a different neighboring country in the past 20 years requiring a large UN sanctioned coalition of countries to militarily push them back and stop further nonsense in the region.
3. Not only defied UN sanctions but actively engaged UN forces that were enforcing a "no-fly zone" in certain parts of the country
4. Had largest standing military in the region.
5. Dictator of this country had offspring that were every bit as bad as the original if no moreso....and were just waiting for dear old dad to kick off so they could have some real fun.

Does any of this apply to North Korea or the other countries mentioned? You're still having trouble with the title of this thread aren't you. Anyone who posts anything other than GEORGE BUSH WAS FUCKING RETARD LOLOLOLOLOLOL is automatically making "excuses" in your mind? Anyone who knows me irl (as in friends, family, coworkers..not on the intarwebs) knows that I was never a GWB fan (even back in 00) and would laugh if someone told them otherwise. My feeling that some kind of intervention in Iraq was inevitable is based on the fact that I am old enough to clearly remember gulf war 1, and paid attention to events since the "cease fire". Since you can't quite seem to grasp it...I am simply saying that I saw it coming eventually, not that I believe it was absolutely the right thing to do.
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Old 04-20-2010, 10:08 AM joemama is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joemama View Post
Ok, lets see..

1. Had a long war with a neighboring country in the past 25 years
2. Invaded a different neighboring country in the past 20 years requiring a large UN sanctioned coalition of countries to militarily push them back and stop further nonsense in the region.
3. Not only defied UN sanctions but actively engaged UN forces that were enforcing a "no-fly zone" in certain parts of the country
4. Had largest standing military in the region.
5. Dictator of this country had offspring that were every bit as bad as the original if no moreso....and were just waiting for dear old dad to kick off so they could have some real fun.

Does any of this apply to North Korea or the other countries mentioned? You're still having trouble with the title of this thread aren't you. Anyone who posts anything other than GEORGE BUSH WAS FUCKING RETARD LOLOLOLOLOLOL is automatically making "excuses" in your mind? Anyone who knows me irl (as in friends, family, coworkers..not on the intarwebs) knows that I was never a GWB fan (even back in 00) and would laugh if someone told them otherwise. My feeling that some kind of intervention in Iraq was inevitable is based on the fact that I am old enough to clearly remember gulf war 1, and paid attention to events since the "cease fire". Since you can't quite seem to grasp it...I am simply saying that I saw it coming eventually, not that I believe it was absolutely the right thing to do.
So basically you repeated the excuses which are for the most part valid for just about any country that isn't tragically hip in the western world,, and you added on the fly, an imaginary 25 year frame to further your marvellous point. Nice
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Old 04-20-2010, 10:33 AM Straw Man is offline  
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Bukkakeboy
 
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So basically you repeated the excuses which are for the most part valid for just about any country that isn't tragically hip in the western world,, and you added on the fly, an imaginary 25 year frame to further your marvellous point. Nice

thank you
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Old 04-20-2010, 11:14 AM Bukkakeboy is offline  
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Gibonius
 
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Ok, lets see..

1. Had a long war with a neighboring country in the past 25 years
2. Invaded a different neighboring country in the past 20 years requiring a large UN sanctioned coalition of countries to militarily push them back and stop further nonsense in the region.
3. Not only defied UN sanctions but actively engaged UN forces that were enforcing a "no-fly zone" in certain parts of the country
4. Had largest standing military in the region.
5. Dictator of this country had offspring that were every bit as bad as the original if no moreso....and were just waiting for dear old dad to kick off so they could have some real fun.

Does any of this apply to North Korea or the other countries mentioned?

North Korea is:
Still at war with the US and South Korea
Already has the son of a former dictator in power, with a power struggle over the leadership
when he dies looming.
Said dictator is mentally unbalanced
Has one of the largest militaries in the world, one which was not recently ground into a fine paste by the US.
Routinely engages in low level skirmishes (sending subs into South Korean waters, etc)
Actually has WMD for a fact, including nukes.


There are some obvious reasons why we're not going to go after North Korea (the safety of South Korea not least of them), but let's not pretend Iraq was the biggest or most pressing threat to world peace.

We also need to consider the fact that removing Saddam increased the threat posed by Iran. Beyond that, the stretching of US forces helped destabilize Afghanistan AND Pakistan (which also has nukes).
Old 04-20-2010, 11:57 AM Gibonius is offline  
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joemama
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North Korea is:
Still at war with the US and South Korea
Already has the son of a former dictator in power, with a power struggle over the leadership
when he dies looming.
Said dictator is mentally unbalanced
Has one of the largest militaries in the world, one which was not recently ground into a fine paste by the US.
Routinely engages in low level skirmishes (sending subs into South Korean waters, etc)
Actually has WMD for a fact, including nukes.


There are some obvious reasons why we're not going to go after North Korea (the safety of South Korea not least of them), but let's not pretend Iraq was the biggest or most pressing threat to world peace.

We also need to consider the fact that removing Saddam increased the threat posed by Iran. Beyond that, the stretching of US forces helped destabilize Afghanistan AND Pakistan (which also has nukes).
My statement wasn't meant to stir debate about any of that stuff, I was simply asked why I thought a invasion (or some sort of military action) against Iraq was inevitable and I answered it. You and others are reading WAAAAAAAAAY too much into that.
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Old 04-20-2010, 03:14 PM joemama is offline  
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joemama
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So basically you repeated the excuses which are for the most part valid for just about any country that isn't tragically hip in the western world,, and you added on the fly, an imaginary 25 year frame to further your marvellous point. Nice
Your "excuses" are simply my reasons why I thought something would go down with Iraq eventually (I didn't even list all of them) .....making no statement about whether or not it's right or wrong. If I see dark clouds in the sky and feel moisture in the air I say "it's probably going to rain today"...doesn't mean I'm pledging allegiance to the one weatherman that said there was a chance the day before while all the rest forecast sunny skies.
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Old 04-20-2010, 03:19 PM joemama is offline  
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Straw Man
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Your "excuses" are simply my reasons why I thought something would go down with Iraq eventually (I didn't even list all of them) .....making no statement about whether or not it's right or wrong. If I see dark clouds in the sky and feel moisture in the air I say "it's probably going to rain today"...doesn't mean I'm pledging allegiance to the one weatherman that said there was a chance the day before while all the rest forecast sunny skies.

I'm not really claiming that either. I just find it really fucking odd that you're trying to explain this through means that aren't there.
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Old 04-20-2010, 03:46 PM Straw Man is offline  
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