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Ralph
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Overconfidence View Post
steroids are given all the time to people to increase their fucking health which I guess would make them better at athletics.

what the FUCK does "intended" mean to you? Athletes don't "intend" to enhance their performance when they use steroids? They can just not use steriods THAT often and just get a little bit buff, is that okay?



I couldn't have been any clearer in my post, but you missed the point by several thousand light years. If you don't understand the difference between abusing medication and using it as intended you're fucking hopeless
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Old 12-17-2008, 10:48 PM Ralph is offline  
#46  

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Overconfidence
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph View Post


I couldn't have been any clearer in my post, but you missed the point by several thousand light years. If you don't understand the difference between abusing medication and using it as intended you're fucking hopeless

/facepalm

you're saying that no amount of use of mental performance enhancing drugs constitutes abuse, whereas there is a point at which the use of physical performance enhancing drugs becomes abuse.
Old 12-17-2008, 11:00 PM Overconfidence is offline  
#47  

Straw Man
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph View Post
One of my original points was that comparing adderall to performance enhancing steroids isn't a valid argument, are you fucking brain-dead or do you just have an extremely selective memory?
The method of administration has goddamn fuck all to do with any of it, you fucking imbecile. Steroids and adderall can be both used accordingly, and unaccordingly. Just because you're a fucking retard that thinks applying creme to someone's ass makes it any more or less acceptable, valid, or ethically honest doesn't mean you're not:

-a fucking cretin
-clueless on everything
Quote:

Adderall: Prescribed to thousands of children every day to increase academic performance.

Steroids: Never prescribed for performance enhancing purposes.
False. If you wish to argue it's unethical, fine.
Furthermore, a genuine ADHD/ADD usage is hardly a fact you can draw "to increase academic performance". That's like saying someone with prosthetic legs got them solely to increase his 100m dash times. If you weren't a drooling fucking imbecile, you'd understand that.
Quote:
Using steroids for athletic gains is ABUSE, using adderall for academic gains is INTENDED. How the fuck do you not see the difference
Intended by who is the question? Again, if you weren't a drooling fucking imbecile, you'd understand that. Both have medical purposes, both are abusable. You apparently think some fucktard juicing roids in the ass with a needle makes it much more dangerous or ethically questionable. Again, if you weren't a drooling fucking imbecile you'd understand.
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Old 12-18-2008, 12:17 AM Straw Man is offline  
#48  

oleo
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I would much rather use drugs than get a good night sleep.
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Old 12-18-2008, 09:31 AM oleo is offline  
#49  

Straw Man
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Once again, just to pour fuel:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph View Post
Are you honestly trying to say that injecting steroids is equivalent to using an asthma inhaler or skin cream?
Why yes, yes it fucking is. They are methods of administration. Nothing more, nothing less. I guess by your logic, snorting coke is normal because it's practically inhaled, but injecting it is abuse of the fucking substance. I wish you weren't a fucking retard to the point where you don't even understand how fucking embarrassing you are


Quote:
You can either admit A.) You're wrong and doctors don't actually prescribe the performance enhancing steroids that are relevant to this discussion or B.) You're a complete moron for comparing inhalers and skin creams to adderall.
You're a fucking idiot for:

a)classifying substances through method of administration
b)actually living under the assumption doctors go around prescribing left and right, fucking amphetamines to people just for shit and giggles, and there's no diagnosis (be it false or not)

What fucking difference does it make if a doctor subscribes what the fuck ever, for who the fuck ever? Do you fucking understand that steroid usage in high level sports is generally done under prescription, the administration, and consulting of a *gasp* doctor? Any motherfucker that wants to, can go to a doctor and get some fucked up chemicals through deceit. Apparently to you, that's very necessary because a fucking doctor put a stamp on the thing. My god, just fucking kill yourself.
Quote:
Adderall is prescribed to children to increase performance, steroids are NOT. Big difference
And steroids are prescribed to increase performance. Your fucking point?
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Old 12-18-2008, 11:27 AM Straw Man is offline  
#50  

Internets LOL
 
Anabolic steroids and the steroids you get for a bad rash aren't the same. They are called corticosteroids.
Old 12-18-2008, 01:37 PM Internets LOL is offline  
#51  

Arjuna
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph View Post
One of my original points was that comparing adderall to performance enhancing steroids isn't a valid argument, are you fucking brain-dead or do you just have an extremely selective memory?

Adderall: Prescribed to thousands of children every day to increase academic performance.

Steroids: Never prescribed for performance enhancing purposes.

Using steroids for athletic gains is ABUSE, using adderall for academic gains is INTENDED. How the fuck do you not see the difference

If we're going to be talking medicine and prescriptions, lets get our shit straight.

Adderall is indicated for the treatment of several medical conditions. It is not indicated for academic performance enhancement. Period. Feel free to peruse the package insert for evidence to the contrary. http://www.fda.gov/medwaTCH/safety/2...dderall_PI.pdf. Its a gripping read.

As for the topic at hand - adderall doesn't make you more intelligent. It just facilitates concentration. With this in mind, two pertinent truths: 1) Everyone is capable of sustained concentration (barring certain medical conditions such as ADHD); and 2) Adderall has side effects, some of which are serious (see: the prominently displayed black box warning heading that product insert). In a normal person, adderall facilitates more intense bursts of what that normal person is already capable of without the drug. Thus, prescribing the drug to healthy individuals exposes them to potentially serious side effects to provide something they are intrinsically capable of. This isn't what a procrastinating high school student wants to hear but if we're talking medicine, that's it right there. That student can achieve the same academic success without the drug (and potential side effects) with a modicum of studying discipline instead.
Old 12-18-2008, 03:08 PM Arjuna is offline  
#52  

jkrowling
 
i am extremely torn on this.

much good fiction has been written under the influence. much good papers have been done under the influence.

but you should be able to do it by yourself. if you don't have the capacity to create something without putting something into your body, you'll never feel satisfied if you work sober. you have to be able to work sober, to write sober, to function sober, or else you will become dependent on the drug, period.

so i haven't done it.
but i've wanted to at times so so badly...
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Old 12-18-2008, 07:21 PM jkrowling is offline  
#53  

Ralph
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RuHo View Post
Why yes, yes it fucking is. They are methods of administration. Nothing more, nothing less.

Just shut the fuck up before you embarrass yourself any more

Quote:
Originally Posted by Internets LOL View Post
Anabolic steroids and the steroids you get for a bad rash aren't the same. They are called corticosteroids.

^^^

Straw Man you're one of the dumbest fucktards on this entire forum. If I ever wondered how you got that name you've now made it painfully clear
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The above post is an explicit representation of the views and opinions of CrowdGather. We at CrowdGather also support all medical advice contained herein and do recommend "trying it at home."
Old 12-18-2008, 08:12 PM Ralph is offline  
#54  

Gibonius
 
Lots of people do get prescribed anabolic steroids by legitimate doctors. Plenty more get them from various shady doctors. If you're 30 years old, don't like your declining testosterone level and want a nice muscle boost, you can just find a willing doctor, get a testosterone test, and they'll give you a script for anabolics. Same deal with human growth hormone. All these baseball players and other pro athletes get their drugs from some sham doctor, they aren't getting them off the street.
Old 12-18-2008, 09:22 PM Gibonius is offline  
#55  

Straw Man
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph View Post
Just shut the fuck up before you embarrass yourself any more
Excellent rebuttal by the village idiot who seems to live under the assumption doctors prescribe amphetamines to people just for shit and giggles. Have you ever wondered why needles are icky, and why headache remedies aren't generally injected?


Quote:
^^^

Straw Man you're one of the dumbest fucktards on this entire forum. If I ever wondered how you got that name you've now made it painfully clear
Yeah because I made the brilliant argument abusing medicine in categorized through ingestion methods
Fuck, you sound like you're fucking twelve.
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Old 12-18-2008, 11:13 PM Straw Man is offline  
#56  

jkrowling
 
Just because ADHD is grossly over diagnosed doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Just because the medicine we have to help ADHD isn't perfect, and has performance enhancing side effects, doesn't mean that it is prescribed to boost performance.

If you're talking about the society's role in facilitating pharmacology for helping people with ADHD do better in society's own schools, then make a new thread. That's something that interests me quite a bit, and I have some strong opinions. But don't misrepresent what doctors actually intend when they prescribe Adderall.
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Old 12-19-2008, 09:31 AM jkrowling is offline  
#57  

d_brow
 
never used any of that shit and never will. I dont see a point, if shit gets this stressful in your job are you gunna start popping pills aswell?
Old 12-19-2008, 12:36 PM d_brow is offline  
#58  

ry_goody
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkrowling View Post
i am extremely torn on this.

much good fiction has been written under the influence. much good papers have been done under the influence.

but you should be able to do it by yourself. if you don't have the capacity to create something without putting something into your body, you'll never feel satisfied if you work sober. you have to be able to work sober, to write sober, to function sober, or else you will become dependent on the drug, period.

so i haven't done it.
but i've wanted to at times so so badly...

becoming dependent on a substance is not bad if the substance is good for you

The issue with drug addiction is not the fact people get addicted. It's that they do not exhaust all the potential plants and substances to discover which one is the best for them and would be ok to form a life-long relationship with.
Old 12-19-2008, 01:26 PM ry_goody is offline  
#59  

Ralph
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RuHo View Post
Excellent rebuttal by the village idiot who seems to live under the assumption doctors prescribe amphetamines to people just for shit and giggles. Have you ever wondered why needles are icky, and why headache remedies aren't generally injected?
And where, exactly, was it implied that they prescribe it "for shit and giggles?"

At this point I've come to realize you have your name for two reasons:
1.) You're utterly moronic and brainless, a la Straw Man in The Wizard of Oz
2.) You use the straw man fallacy liberally because you're incapable of carrying on a rational debate.

Kudos to whoever gave you that name.

Quote:
Yeah because I made the brilliant argument abusing medicine in categorized through ingestion methods
Fuck, you sound like you're fucking twelve.
You brilliantly compared asthma inhalers and skin creams (anti-inflammatory steroids) to anabolic steroids (protein synthesis facilitators), if you don't realize how fucking retarded that is perhaps I can introduce you to my good friend Google? And if all goes well with Google you may even meet Wikipedia!!

Go ahead, say that all steroids are the same again... we could use another good laugh at your expense.
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Old 12-19-2008, 03:36 PM Ralph is offline  
#60  

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