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SemperFly
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmoothFlowing View Post
It is not your place or right to criticize whether or not your government passes a bill on health care.

are you fucking stupid or just completely ignorant as to how the american system of government is set up?

it's not only our right to criticize this but it's our duty as citizens. it's our responsibility to ensure that our government is working in our best interest.
Old 12-17-2009, 11:25 AM SemperFly is offline  
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Zangmonkey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmoothFlowing View Post
Somehow your fascist Conservative Republican mumbo jumbo makes sense however...
It only makes sense due to your countries inherently flawed "laizzes fair" system of governing business and industry. Where else in the world can you find a nation so blatantly obvious in its attempts to cover up its economic shortcomings by waging wars in other countries? Tell me was the over 9 years and billions and billions of dollars spent on "preventing terrorism" better invested more fruitful then passing a bill on universal health care?
In Canada we have one of the highest levels of taxation of any of the developed countries in the world. Yet somehow we manage to not only survive but prosper and not suffer through a "recession" as heavily as our American counterparts.(granted there are some exceptions such as the Canadian auto industry which ironically is reliant on America.) In fact i believe our dollar is sitting near parity at the moment again!.
It is not your place or right to criticize whether or not your government passes a bill on health care.
The American people have the right to live with the same standard of health as Canada. You are not placed on this earth to judge peoples eating habits or lifestyles whether or not they are healthy. Self determination is the right to every free individual and it is the nations responsibility to look after its peoples whether or not they choose to use that self determination wisely.
There's no reason to maintain the war in Afghanistan, the People don't want American Help they certainly dont need it. Time, money and more importantly lives are being wasted there.(Atleast Iraq had oil right?) How many vietnams does The US need in one century before it gets the picture.

Leave Afghanistan end the war and the money you save due to the lowered defense budget will more then cover anything you spend on health care.

But what do i know i'm just a liberal Canadian with Free health care*
(not everything is free but most of it)


Your use of the word "somehow" is indicative of your viewpoint on these problems.

How can you say, with a straight face, that the affairs of our elected leaders passing laws which will affect our entire population and country are none of my concern? Sir, I must say that without some explanation you're not making any sense.

Additionally, I'd like you to do a bit of research on your own country's economy before you lean to heavily on the concept that you "somehow" escaped recesssion.
Do you know what's going on in Alberta? Do you know about the natural resources now being tapped in Canada? The Canadian powerhouse is greatly related to the roaring commodity prices and the recent increase in extraction in Canada.

The American healthcare system is unlike the Canadian system in many ways and I am both glad and unhappy about that depending on the circumstance.
However, many Americans are not upset about "increasing coverage, decreasing cost and increasing competition.
In fact, if the bill did (or could do) that we would likely be in favor. However, few people are convinced. In fact the government itself, in the form of analytical agencies and elected "leaders", are not convinced either.


Also, you would do yourself a great service if you didn't assume that all of the opposition are fascists, ignorant, evil etc.
If you were being "cute" or sarcastic then I apologize; it was not obvious. Otherwise, spend some time attempting to understand the opposition before claiming your seat at the adult's table.
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Old 12-17-2009, 12:44 PM Zangmonkey is offline  
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Electrikfuzz050
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmoothFlowing View Post
Somehow your fascist Conservative Republican mumbo jumbo makes sense however...
It only makes sense due to your countries inherently flawed "laizzes fair" system of governing business and industry. Where else in the world can you find a nation so blatantly obvious in its attempts to cover up its economic shortcomings by waging wars in other countries? Tell me was the over 9 years and billions and billions of dollars spent on "preventing terrorism" better invested more fruitful then passing a bill on universal health care?
In Canada we have one of the highest levels of taxation of any of the developed countries in the world. Yet somehow we manage to not only survive but prosper and not suffer through a "recession" as heavily as our American counterparts.(granted there are some exceptions such as the Canadian auto industry which ironically is reliant on America.) In fact i believe our dollar is sitting near parity at the moment again!.
It is not your place or right to criticize whether or not your government passes a bill on health care.
The American people have the right to live with the same standard of health as Canada. You are not placed on this earth to judge peoples eating habits or lifestyles whether or not they are healthy. Self determination is the right to every free individual and it is the nations responsibility to look after its peoples whether or not they choose to use that self determination wisely.
There's no reason to maintain the war in Afghanistan, the People don't want American Help they certainly dont need it. Time, money and more importantly lives are being wasted there.(Atleast Iraq had oil right?) How many vietnams does The US need in one century before it gets the picture.

Leave Afghanistan end the war and the money you save due to the lowered defense budget will more then cover anything you spend on health care.

But what do i know i'm just a liberal Canadian with Free health care*
(not everything is free but most of it)


Either a troll or a

Well, either a or a troll AND a
Old 12-17-2009, 01:56 PM Electrikfuzz050 is offline  
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Vote McCain!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SemperFly View Post
are you fucking stupid or just completely ignorant as to how the american system of government is set up?

it's not only our right to criticize this but it's our duty as citizens. it's our responsibility to ensure that our government is working in our best interest.

he's canadian

what did you expect?
Old 12-17-2009, 01:59 PM Vote McCain! is offline  
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Jason
 
http://rawstory.com/2009/12/135000-u...-effect-study/
135,000 people will die before health care reform takes effect... even if it passes. That's 45,000 a year.
Although given the numbers of about 35 million people without health insurance, that makes the death rate about 1.28 per thousand... so deducting those numbers from the total, among the insured (2.51 million deaths) it is 9.22 per thousand. You are 7 times more likely to die if you have health insurance than if you do not.
Old 12-17-2009, 02:00 PM Jason is offline  
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SemperFly
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vote McCain! View Post
he's canadian

what did you expect?

even canadians have a sense of responsibility to make sure their government is working for them, not against them
Old 12-17-2009, 02:50 PM SemperFly is offline  
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Gibonius
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason View Post
http://rawstory.com/2009/12/135000-u...-effect-study/
135,000 people will die before health care reform takes effect... even if it passes. That's 45,000 a year.
Although given the numbers of about 35 million people without health insurance, that makes the death rate about 1.28 per thousand... so deducting those numbers from the total, among the insured (2.51 million deaths) it is 9.22 per thousand. You are 7 times more likely to die if you have health insurance than if you do not.

That math seems very fuzzy.
Old 12-17-2009, 03:35 PM Gibonius is offline  
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#52  

Tom Kazansky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmoothFlowing View Post
Somehow your fascist Conservative Republican mumbo jumbo makes sense however...
It only makes sense due to your countries inherently flawed "laizzes fair" system of governing business and industry. Where else in the world can you find a nation so blatantly obvious in its attempts to cover up its economic shortcomings by waging wars in other countries? Tell me was the over 9 years and billions and billions of dollars spent on "preventing terrorism" better invested more fruitful then passing a bill on universal health care?
In Canada we have one of the highest levels of taxation of any of the developed countries in the world. Yet somehow we manage to not only survive but prosper and not suffer through a "recession" as heavily as our American counterparts.(granted there are some exceptions such as the Canadian auto industry which ironically is reliant on America.) In fact i believe our dollar is sitting near parity at the moment again!.
It is not your place or right to criticize whether or not your government passes a bill on health care.
The American people have the right to live with the same standard of health as Canada. You are not placed on this earth to judge peoples eating habits or lifestyles whether or not they are healthy. Self determination is the right to every free individual and it is the nations responsibility to look after its peoples whether or not they choose to use that self determination wisely.
There's no reason to maintain the war in Afghanistan, the People don't want American Help they certainly dont need it. Time, money and more importantly lives are being wasted there.(Atleast Iraq had oil right?) How many vietnams does The US need in one century before it gets the picture.

Leave Afghanistan end the war and the money you save due to the lowered defense budget will more then cover anything you spend on health care.

But what do i know i'm just a liberal Canadian with Free health care*
(not everything is free but most of it)

You know what's sad about this post? You don't only know nothing about the United States, but you also really don't know anything about Canada as well. Congrats.
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Old 12-18-2009, 07:48 AM Tom Kazansky is offline  
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#53  

TheMorlock
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So how about that 700 page "amendment" they tried to tack on?
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Old 12-18-2009, 09:56 AM TheMorlock is offline  
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Jason
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibonius View Post
That math seems very fuzzy.

Yeah, but I didn't find it useful to question their numbers, especially since they were trying to make it sound like a lot. 45,000 a year was probably a stretch.

Oh, you mean my math? It is most likely that the people that live without insurance are young and healthy and have no risk of dying of natural causes any time soon. Those that are uninsured for lack of being able to afford it are not all the numerous.
Old 12-18-2009, 12:46 PM Jason is offline  
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Gibonius
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason View Post
Yeah, but I didn't find it useful to question their numbers, especially since they were trying to make it sound like a lot. 45,000 a year was probably a stretch.

Oh, you mean my math? It is most likely that the people that live without insurance are young and healthy and have no risk of dying of natural causes any time soon. Those that are uninsured for lack of being able to afford it are not all the numerous.

Figured it would be a sampling bias thing.

Of course, the thing with the "death" argument is that hospitals are required to treat any life threatening health issue regardless of the patients ability to pay. That really limits the cases where anyone is going to die from not having insurance. Lots of people go bankrupt because of not having insurance though, or not having adequate insurance. That's really the better argument, not people dying.
Old 12-18-2009, 01:29 PM Gibonius is offline  
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Zangmonkey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMorlock View Post
So how about that 700 page "amendment" they tried to tack on?

Nonsense.
Obama promised to ban earmarks.
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Old 12-18-2009, 01:53 PM Zangmonkey is offline  
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Zangmonkey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibonius View Post
That math seems very fuzzy.

I was thinking the same thing
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Old 12-18-2009, 01:53 PM Zangmonkey is offline  
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chuckybob
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zangmonkey View Post
Nonsense.
Obama promised to ban earmarks.

did he really?
Old 12-18-2009, 01:54 PM chuckybob is offline  
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möbiustrip
 
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THANKS, DIP SHITS
Quote:
link w/ video

It does very little to reform the insurance monopolies. It does very little to create more choices... but at the same time it mandates that everybody in America face penalties if they don't buy health care

WellPoint stocks are up 12.6% since November 17. United Health Group, Aetna and Humana are also up significantly.
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Old 12-19-2009, 12:55 PM möbiustrip is offline  
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