General [M]ayhem

Go Back   General [M]ayhem > Real Time Sub-Forums > The Pit
Register Members List Mark Forums Read [M]erchandise Calendar

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Tom Kazansky
911 Was an Inside Job. Bush is traitor like Prescott Bush
 
Tom Kazansky's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by s0me0nesmind1 View Post
I see advantages and disadvantages. Kinda nice to not support unproductive druggies. But it also costs more money to drug test people (I assume they are doing drug tests for free?)

Presumably the cost of administering a drug test would not be in excess of month's welfare payment. At least around here, welfare is $585/month, and I can't imagine it would cost that much or much more to test for drugs.
__________________
ERTW - Engineers Rule The World
Old 02-15-2010, 02:17 PM Tom Kazansky is offline  
Reply With Quote
#91  

Advertisement [Remove Advertisement]

tegandje
LOOK AT ME, IM A FUCKIN HIPSTER
 
tegandje's Avatar
 
I'll put it in a cliffs version for you:

Poor people don't get money b/c of drug testing
Poor person can't get a job b/c no permanent residence
Poor person's choices?
A. Beg
B. Borrow
C. Steal

First option = decent money
Second option = probably not gonna borrow much from your broke friends
Third option = steal - higher risk, but higher rewards

The cost of welfare isn't that much when you think of what can happen if you take away that helping hand
When you cross out the choices that are available to a person, they are going to become destructive. People develop a horrible mindset and you can't blame them. They are going to take what isn't theirs, kill who they need to and do what they have to.
Self preservation at its best - I believe there were case studies in the 1980's about this, but I don't know how to read so I couldn't explain it to you.

I'm retarded.
__________________
b35b36db324a18b072d431f4fbb833d1 [y yuo throw haet :( :(] porn may <3's yuo.
Old 02-15-2010, 03:00 PM tegandje is offline  
Reply With Quote
#92  

Gibonius
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andje View Post
I'll put it in a cliffs version for you:

Poor people don't get money b/c of drug testing
Poor person can't get a job b/c no permanent residence
Poor person's choices?
A. Beg
B. Borrow
C. Steal

First option = decent money
Second option = probably not gonna borrow much from your broke friends
Third option = steal - higher risk, but higher rewards
.

You seem to have forgotten an obvious Option 4: Don't fucking do drugs and get your welfare.
Old 02-15-2010, 03:04 PM Gibonius is offline  
Reply With Quote
#93  

tegandje
LOOK AT ME, IM A FUCKIN HIPSTER
 
tegandje's Avatar
 
Sometimes it isn't so cut and dry. People who are on drugs can't just quit and even if they did, they might still test positive. I'm sure you know people who have gotten fired for stupid mistakes - sometimes people just need a helping hand. Most homeless people can't afford to quit a habit that sustains them. If they do they will probably freeze to death while vomiting in the fetal position.

You're a chemistry dude, I'm sure you've been around with people that were chem majors who volunteered out the ass and were going to be doctors/whatevers. I know I did.

Believe me, I don't want to pay for some fat idiot to sit around all day.
__________________
b35b36db324a18b072d431f4fbb833d1 [y yuo throw haet :( :(] porn may <3's yuo.
Old 02-15-2010, 03:11 PM tegandje is offline  
Reply With Quote
#94  

Gibonius
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andje View Post
Sometimes it isn't so cut and dry. People who are on drugs can't just quit and even if they did, they might still test positive. I'm sure you know people who have gotten fired for stupid mistakes - sometimes people just need a helping hand. Most homeless people can't afford to quit a habit that sustains them. If they do they will probably freeze to death while vomiting in the fetal position.
Give people access to treatment programs instead of just paying for their welfare and enabling their drug use.

I can see a lot of people choosing not to start taking drugs if they knew they would be tested when they picked up their food stamps. Of the people who are already using, the threat of losing their meal ticket might be enough to move them into treatment. It's a pretty basic carrot and stick thing.

And homeless people are a pretty small % of the welfare population.

Quote:
You're a chemistry dude, I'm sure you've been around with people that were chem majors who volunteered out the ass and were going to be doctors/whatevers. I know I did.
Not sure how that has anything to do with anything?
Old 02-15-2010, 03:57 PM Gibonius is offline  
Reply With Quote
#95  

s0me0nesmind1
 
s0me0nesmind1's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andje View Post
I'll put it in a cliffs version for you:

Poor people don't get money b/c of drug testing
Poor person can't get a job b/c no permanent residence
Poor person's choices?
A. Beg
B. Borrow
C. Steal

First option = decent money
Second option = probably not gonna borrow much from your broke friends
Third option = steal - higher risk, but higher rewards

The cost of welfare isn't that much when you think of what can happen if you take away that helping hand
When you cross out the choices that are available to a person, they are going to become destructive. People develop a horrible mindset and you can't blame them. They are going to take what isn't theirs, kill who they need to and do what they have to.
Self preservation at its best - I believe there were case studies in the 1980's about this, but I don't know how to read so I couldn't explain it to you.

I'm retarded.

Gotta call some here - Way too many options that offer assistance to homeless people - including a place to live.
__________________
8e12bfe909ef9fcfaa2d400a638d4801 [y yuo throw haet :( :(] porn may <3's yuo.
◑ ◔
╔═╗
║▒▒▒▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓
╚═╝
Old 02-15-2010, 05:03 PM s0me0nesmind1 is offline  
Reply With Quote
#96  

Tom Kazansky
911 Was an Inside Job. Bush is traitor like Prescott Bush
 
Tom Kazansky's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andje View Post
I'll put it in a cliffs version for you:

Poor people don't get money b/c of drug testing
Poor person can't get a job b/c no permanent residence
Poor person's choices?
A. Beg
B. Borrow
C. Steal

First option = decent money
Second option = probably not gonna borrow much from your broke friends
Third option = steal - higher risk, but higher rewards

The cost of welfare isn't that much when you think of what can happen if you take away that helping hand
When you cross out the choices that are available to a person, they are going to become destructive. People develop a horrible mindset and you can't blame them. They are going to take what isn't theirs, kill who they need to and do what they have to.
Self preservation at its best - I believe there were case studies in the 1980's about this, but I don't know how to read so I couldn't explain it to you.

There are better options than simply granting them welfare. Frankly I'd rather see the state's money being invested in creating solutions to get people off of drugs than give them my tax dollars to support their illegal bad habits.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andje View Post
I'm retarded.



That was awesome, thanks for the laugh .
__________________
ERTW - Engineers Rule The World
Old 02-15-2010, 05:53 PM Tom Kazansky is offline  
Reply With Quote
#97  

Tom Kazansky
911 Was an Inside Job. Bush is traitor like Prescott Bush
 
Tom Kazansky's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andje View Post
Sometimes it isn't so cut and dry. People who are on drugs can't just quit and even if they did, they might still test positive.

But that doesn't mean it helps them or the State to finance their drug habit. The whole idea is not to pay for someone's heroin or cocaine habit with the people's tax dollars, and that's not unreasonable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andje View Post
Most homeless people can't afford to quit a habit that sustains them.

I disagree. If anything, the high cost on the street of illegal drugs is something that's preventing them from not being homeless.
__________________
ERTW - Engineers Rule The World
Old 02-15-2010, 06:00 PM Tom Kazansky is offline  
Reply With Quote
#98  

tegandje
LOOK AT ME, IM A FUCKIN HIPSTER
 
tegandje's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibonius View Post
Not sure how that has anything to do with anything?

Seeing the people who can't quit or volunteering to help people w/ controlled substance problems?

Who actually read that before looking at the bottom?
I probably shouldn't do that in this forum.

Drug addicts should just all quit cold turkey - it's not like they will go into shock or a coma or anything.


But yeh, alot of these people are just displaced workers who are trying to make a comeback a la George Foreman.
__________________
b35b36db324a18b072d431f4fbb833d1 [y yuo throw haet :( :(] porn may <3's yuo.
Old 02-15-2010, 08:18 PM tegandje is offline  
Reply With Quote
#99  

illig
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andje View Post
Drug addicts should just all quit cold turkey - it's not like they will go into shock or a coma or anything.

you cannot be serios

quitting/withdrawal is too hard so it's better to pay them to be on drugs indefinitely?

what kind of logic is that?

if you want to blow vast amounts of YOUR PERSONAL EARNED money on drugs that's your choice (seriously, i'm all for legalizing most drugs) but doing so with what little remains of my tax money after defense and medicare take their cut is fucking ridiculous

that shit should be spent on schools or roads or something else that's actually useful to society
Old 02-15-2010, 09:05 PM illig is offline  
Reply With Quote
#100  

s0me0nesmind1
 
s0me0nesmind1's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andje View Post
Seeing the people who can't quit or volunteering to help people w/ controlled substance problems?

Who actually read that before looking at the bottom?
I probably shouldn't do that in this forum.

Drug addicts should just all quit cold turkey - it's not like they will go into shock or a coma or anything.


But yeh, alot of these people are just displaced workers who are trying to make a comeback a la George Foreman.

Now you're just halfway diving into another topic ala "Why the fuck should I and/or We care if a bunch of inbred fucks die and make this country better in the process?" But hey - everyone is equal, try equally hard, and you know - that guy who would go into a coma from coming off heroin could be the next president!
__________________
8e12bfe909ef9fcfaa2d400a638d4801 [y yuo throw haet :( :(] porn may <3's yuo.
◑ ◔
╔═╗
║▒▒▒▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓
╚═╝
Old 02-15-2010, 09:41 PM s0me0nesmind1 is offline  
Reply With Quote
#101  

tegandje
LOOK AT ME, IM A FUCKIN HIPSTER
 
tegandje's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by illig View Post
you cannot be serios

quitting/withdrawal is too hard so it's better to pay them to be on drugs indefinitely?

what kind of logic is that?

if you want to blow vast amounts of YOUR PERSONAL EARNED money on drugs that's your choice (seriously, i'm all for legalizing most drugs) but doing so with what little remains of my tax money after defense and medicare take their cut is fucking ridiculous

that shit should be spent on schools or roads or something else that's actually useful to society

The taxes me and you pay? That's probably used to give relief to some third world country so they don't destroy us later.

I'm not some drug addled person, but I'm just well aware of what happens to people when they go down that path.

Quote:
Originally Posted by s0me0nesmind1 View Post
Now you're just halfway diving into another topic ala "Why the fuck should I and/or We care if a bunch of inbred fucks die and make this country better in the process?" But hey - everyone is equal, try equally hard, and you know - that guy who would go into a coma from coming off heroin could be the next president!

Unless he is a felon, he has just as much say as you or I do on who is in charge blah blah blah
__________________
b35b36db324a18b072d431f4fbb833d1 [y yuo throw haet :( :(] porn may <3's yuo.
Old 02-15-2010, 10:30 PM tegandje is offline  
Reply With Quote
#102  

Xayd
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Kazansky View Post
I don't see what you're getting at. What does that have to do with welfare payments and drug testing? Are you suggesting the State is better off funding their drug habits so they don't do something else illegal in order to obtain them?

yes. it would cost less than the prisons.
Old 02-15-2010, 11:04 PM Xayd is offline  
Reply With Quote
#103  

Jason
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xayd View Post
yes. it would cost less than the prisons.

Same argument is made against the death penalty... life in prison is cheaper than death. I'll agree with it.

Edit: I am also for legalizing drugs and mandatory drug testing for any government office, job, or handout... that includes the bankers.
Old 02-16-2010, 12:17 AM Jason is offline  
Reply With Quote
#104  

s0me0nesmind1
 
s0me0nesmind1's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andje View Post
Unless he is a felon, he has just as much say as you or I do on who is in charge blah blah blah

Good thing he would never make his way to a location to make that say
__________________
8e12bfe909ef9fcfaa2d400a638d4801 [y yuo throw haet :( :(] porn may <3's yuo.
◑ ◔
╔═╗
║▒▒▒▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓
╚═╝
Old 02-16-2010, 12:55 AM s0me0nesmind1 is offline  
Reply With Quote
#105  

Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:42 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.