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[H]ard|On
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Originally Posted by afxacid View Post
the american dream is starting your own fuking company - not relying on someone else to provide a job for you

We pay with taxes for our right to live here and beenfit from this country by way of residence, employment, protection, and so forth. If you're doing super duper well, maybe you ought to help out around the place. It's patriotic. Humane. It's the sort of thing Jesus would do. What is puzzling is how all the Jesus lovers traditionally side with the people who basically stand for the total opposite.

If you consider the truly rich, and I believe smart people like Gates and Seinfield they voluntarily increase their taxes anyway, by donating 100s of millions of dollars to charity and various causes. Republicans argue that's the natural way and you could better control where the money goes, as they go home and never donate shit.

The problem of course is that it's actually the government's job to control that. It has been proven to work. We don't need a 3rd party with some sort of Huckabee flat 30% sales tax. If you live here and do well, help make it a better place - that's what the tiered tax system is about. Uncle sam get's paid commission for helping us out and everyone wins. Why do you need to obsess over every last dollar? So you can collect rare dinosaur skulls... while real problems go on in the world.

All the poor will revolt if all become the poor. I forgot who said that. I think I heard it somewhere but it's historically accurate!

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Last edited by [H]ard|On; 10-04-2011 at 07:23 PM..
Old 10-04-2011, 07:16 PM [H]ard|On is offline  
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#106  

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Redrum
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more and more of your posts read like out right shills for moveon.org

how much are they paying you

btw, remember when buffet said billionaires should pay more taxes? i remember reading an article that came out not even a week after he made that statement showing he owed millions in back taxes
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Old 10-04-2011, 09:19 PM Redrum is offline  
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Colicious
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yeah, because it would be stupid to place the blame on the poor people at the bottom of the totem pole for the governmental and banking policies that they have zero power over.

also, that's not true. Clinton and the dems did't want the banks to go nuts giving out liar loans. they wanted the banks to stop redlining minorities and refusing to ever give them loans. the banks didn't like this but once they figured out how to repackage and resell the loans they were all off to the races. government may have planted the seed and individual greed may have played its part but the institutional greed of the banks made the problem what into what it became.

to blame this situation on poor people who couldn't even understand the terms of the loans they were given is to buy into the fucking lie that those damn greedy poor people caused the financial mess we are in.

quite frankly that is stupid and another attempt to shift the blame onto the people who have the least amount of money and power in the whole scenario. individual poor people only took out the one loan to try and improve their lives, maybe they didn't understand the loan terms, maybe they were too greedy but they only took out the one loan. The banks were the ones giving out as many of these loans as they could to people who didn't understand them and couldn't pay them.

And they knew this and they continued to do it anyway. And they continued to do it even as the whole house of cards was tumbling down. they continued to make and repackage and resell these loans even as they were privately betting against them. They made obscene amounts of money and then when the party was over and the economy crashed WE GOT TO BAIL THEM OUT.

And the real kicker is you are trying to blame the people who got the shaft in all of this. whether it was ignorance or greed, the people at the bottom who couldn't pay their loans are the only ones getting punished for this mess. the banks are doing just fine. the bankers are doing just fine and are just as rich as ever. the poor people who thought that they had a shot at the american dream are the only ones being punished and now you want to blame them too. well, I will not be part of your silly delusion.

I blame the fat cats who walked away from the whole situation even richer than before, not everyone else who got fucked in the ass and then were made to pay for the privilege of getting raped.

dont forget about the people who took out a 2nd mortgage. and dont forget that the clinton administration told the GSEs to guarantee those loans to the people that were previously turned down. how can you say thats not true? it is true. and you blame the banks for making a dollar on it? the government comes in and says to lower your credit policy and we (the gov't) will buy these loans from you and guarantee them ourselves. they did exactly as they were told. as bad as it sounds (in a half serious/half joking way) but thats business bro
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Old 10-04-2011, 09:41 PM Colicious is offline  
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Colicious
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I have to do a self quote on this.... Colicious if you aren't a millionaire then you aren't working hard enough and you're a pussy, so maybe you need to shut the fuck up.

no, im not one yet. im working on it.

and id shut up, but im no the one complaining about no jobs and a gigantic student loan in a field with no jobs to begin with
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Old 10-04-2011, 09:44 PM Colicious is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redrum View Post
more and more of your posts read like out right shills for moveon.org

how much are they paying you



I wish.
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Old 10-04-2011, 09:57 PM pyramid is offline  
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not you

you're always sort of semi reasonable

but hardon is definitely a shill
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Old 10-04-2011, 10:04 PM Redrum is offline  
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dont forget about the people who took out a 2nd mortgage. and dont forget that the clinton administration told the GSEs to guarantee those loans to the people that were previously turned down. how can you say thats not true? it is true. and you blame the banks for making a dollar on it? the government comes in and says to lower your credit policy and we (the gov't) will buy these loans from you and guarantee them ourselves. they did exactly as they were told. as bad as it sounds (in a half serious/half joking way) but thats business bro

You're just sucking down the pro-finance propaganda Koolaid if you believe for a second that the banks weren't just GAGGING to issue all those shitty loans. The government set up some policies to make it appealing, but the banks were the ones that went hog wild on it and then turned it into a national crisis by leveraging the hell out of them. If they actually believed the loans were bad, they'd have been criminally incompetent to do so.

The biggest failure of the government was lack of regulation (and maybe artificially low interest rates), not being overly active. Allowing commercial banks to become investment banks to become mega-banks has been a disaster.
Old 10-04-2011, 10:25 PM Gibonius is offline  
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if the banks didn't want to be in the subprime game they would have issued as few subprimes as they could. some did, others quite obviously did not.

the fact that they could turn around and blame it on the government afterwards was the perfect cover. or so they thought.

the redlining issue wasn't even about giving loans to unworthy people. it was about equally qualified inner city minorities being denied loans under similar conditions that non-inner-city non-minorities would have been approved.
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Old 10-04-2011, 10:46 PM pyramid is offline  
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yeah except they were given a HUGE incentive to issue all of those sub primes out because the government was willing to guarantee them...easy money. it had good intentions sure, but how does that saying go about hell and good intentions? crackpot social programs like that the meddle with the flow of capital and the standards that banks have to hold themselves to (not lending to half literate buffoons with a shitty credit history) to remain profitable only makes recessions like this that much worse...

this recession is the result of a thousand tiny cuts from every direction, placing the blame on particular group (no matter how detestable and greedy they actually are) is very simplistic and herpa derp.
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Old 10-04-2011, 10:57 PM Redrum is offline  
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the government only guaranteed their after the fact. there was no prior agreement.

I'm not placing all the blame on the greedy fat cats, just most of it.
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Old 10-04-2011, 11:03 PM pyramid is offline  
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Colicious
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Originally Posted by Gibonius View Post
You're just sucking down the pro-finance propaganda Koolaid if you believe for a second that the banks weren't just GAGGING to issue all those shitty loans. The government set up some policies to make it appealing, but the banks were the ones that went hog wild on it and then turned it into a national crisis by leveraging the hell out of them. If they actually believed the loans were bad, they'd have been criminally incompetent to do so.

The biggest failure of the government was lack of regulation (and maybe artificially low interest rates), not being overly active. Allowing commercial banks to become investment banks to become mega-banks has been a disaster.

of course they were, thats business bro. but only AFTER the fact the government came in and said they would guarantee the loans and buy them from the originators

they have been turning mortgages into securities since atleast right after WW2 when all the soldiers came back home and passed the GI bill
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Old 10-04-2011, 11:04 PM Colicious is offline  
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Colicious
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the government only guaranteed their after the fact. there was no prior agreement.

I'm not placing all the blame on the greedy fat cats, just most of it.

. it was their idea
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Old 10-04-2011, 11:05 PM Colicious is offline  
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. it was their idea

fatcats? yeah.

government? yeah, no.

unlimited liar loans repackaged into securities was never the government's idea.
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Old 10-04-2011, 11:07 PM pyramid is offline  
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Colicious
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fatcats? yeah.

government? yeah, no.

unlimited liar loans repackaged into securities was never the government's idea.

do you know what fannie mae is?
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Old 10-04-2011, 11:09 PM Colicious is offline  
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lol at this guy
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Old 10-04-2011, 11:15 PM mikeawesome is offline  
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