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pepperochini
 
The god damn "DREAM ACT"

Financial aid for illegals. Really? Our country is a tattered rag trying to make it through another washing machine cycle and these fucking morons think it's a good time to start spending our tax dollars on educating the fucking world? We have budget cuts in college, not enough classes, you literally have to fight for some classes... and these morons think that introducing more students to the mix is going to help? What the fuck.

If we have so much money saved up, California should pay off the student debt of every single CA resident that is here legally before it spends a grimey penny on an illegal. I don't care how you got here or what your sob story is, you are an illegal; not an undocumented immigrant.

I just can't wrap my head around this one. It just doesn't make any sense.
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Old 10-15-2011, 01:19 AM pepperochini is offline  
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g|aSsJaw
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I think it's a promising idea in theory, but it's going to piss off a lot of people for a very long time. I know that here in California, 80 or 90 percent of the people polled were against it.
Old 10-15-2011, 01:40 AM g|aSsJaw is offline  
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There are 3 ways to tackle the problem of illegal/undocumented immigrants in our country: deportation, some form of amnesty (hopefully coupled with immigration reform), or ignore the problem. Deportation is completely unfeasible, and we can't just ignore 10-12 million people who live, work, and learn here.

The beneficiaries of the DREAM Act are essentially American citizens minus actual citizenship. If you don't let them get a quality education (out-of-state tuition is expensive as fuck) and contribute to the economy then you're dooming them to perpetual poverty, which isn't good for anyone. The numbers differ depending on who you ask, obviously, but a lot of reputable organizations claim that the economy will actually benefit from the DREAM Act in the long run. Hell, even Cato supports it.

edit: It does make less sense on the state level because if you can't get citizenship you're gonna have a hard time putting your degree to use
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Last edited by 5ive; 10-15-2011 at 02:08 AM..
Old 10-15-2011, 01:49 AM 5ive is offline  
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You know this law only applies to kids who have been to a California high school for at least 3 years and graduated or have gotten a GED. They already live here, they have already been educated. Or perhaps we should just keep them as grey area second class citizens because of shit their parents did.

*Also, the dream act redistributes $13 million surplus from a $700 financial aid budget. It's not going to make huge waves.
Old 10-15-2011, 02:07 AM TriaD is offline  
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Either we need to totally reform our immigration system from the ground up, or we need to deal with the reality of getting the most out of the hordes of illegals we have here. Trying to just punish them and keep them out of society is not going to work. Basic access to university education is going to make them more productive members of society and help integrate them into mainstream American culture.

It's just the cost of doing business with our fucked immigration system.
Old 10-15-2011, 08:48 AM Gibonius is offline  
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Originally Posted by 5ive View Post
There are 3 ways to tackle the problem of illegal/undocumented immigrants in our country: deportation, some form of amnesty (hopefully coupled with immigration reform), or ignore the problem. Deportation is completely unfeasible, and we can't just ignore 10-12 million people who live, work, and learn here.

The beneficiaries of the DREAM Act are essentially American citizens minus actual citizenship. If you don't let them get a quality education (out-of-state tuition is expensive as fuck) and contribute to the economy then you're dooming them to perpetual poverty, which isn't good for anyone. The numbers differ depending on who you ask, obviously, but a lot of reputable organizations claim that the economy will actually benefit from the DREAM Act in the long run. Hell, even Cato supports it.
TSRH, fuck all you xenophobic retards who can't understand such a simple concept.

Quote:
edit: It does make less sense on the state level because if you can't get citizenship you're gonna have a hard time putting your degree to use
You need to prove that you're applying for citizenship before receiving funds.
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Old 10-15-2011, 11:22 AM :ninja: is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepperochini View Post
Financial aid for illegals. Really? Our country is a tattered rag trying to make it through another washing machine cycle and these fucking morons think it's a good time to start spending our tax dollars on educating the fucking world? We have budget cuts in college, not enough classes, you literally have to fight for some classes... and these morons think that introducing more students to the mix is going to help? What the fuck.

If we have so much money saved up, California should pay off the student debt of every single CA resident that is here legally before it spends a grimey penny on an illegal. I don't care how you got here or what your sob story is, you are an illegal; not an undocumented immigrant.

I just can't wrap my head around this one. It just doesn't make any sense.

DEY TOOK YER EDUKASHUN!
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Old 10-15-2011, 11:24 AM :ninja: is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepperochini View Post
Financial aid for illegals. Really? Our country is a tattered rag trying to make it through another washing machine cycle and these fucking morons think it's a good time to start spending our tax dollars on educating the fucking world? We have budget cuts in college, not enough classes, you literally have to fight for some classes... and these morons think that introducing more students to the mix is going to help? What the fuck.

If we have so much money saved up, California should pay off the student debt of every single CA resident that is here legally before it spends a grimey penny on an illegal. I don't care how you got here or what your sob story is, you are an illegal; not an undocumented immigrant.

I just can't wrap my head around this one. It just doesn't make any sense.

http://first-world-problems.com/
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Old 10-15-2011, 01:14 PM Straw Man is offline  
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just another way for the gubment to get fat off student loans that are not forgivable.


they don't want an educated populace. they just want more morons willing to go into a life time of debt for a sociology degree.
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Old 10-15-2011, 01:29 PM Redrum is offline  
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DEY TOOK YER EDUKASHUN!

lol you're an idiot. the economy is collapsing all around us, white AND blue collar jobs are being shipped abroad, and you think it's a good idea to give people who don't have any papers an opportunity to compete with actual tax paying american citizens?

KILL YOURSELF YOU BRAINWASHED IDIOT
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Old 10-15-2011, 01:31 PM Redrum is offline  
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just another way for the gubment to get fat off student loans that are not forgivable.


they don't want an educated populace. they just want more morons willing to go into a life time of debt for a sociology degree.

yeah no. that's not what it is about. they are giving in state tuition to children of illegal aliens who were brought here as children by their parents through no fault of their own who have grown up here like an american.

personally I don't really see how it is such a special privilege as some are making it out to be. It's just giving in-state tuition rates to someone who lives in state. Big effing deal.
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Old 10-15-2011, 01:38 PM pyramid is offline  
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pepperochini
 
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yeah no. that's not what it is about. they are giving in state tuition to children of illegal aliens who were brought here as children by their parents through no fault of their own who have grown up here like an american.

personally I don't really see how it is such a special privilege as some are making it out to be. It's just giving in-state tuition rates to someone who lives in state. Big effing deal.

say that to the kids who grew up here LEGALLY at no fault of their own and are now $100k in debt, costs they will not be able to recuperate for a very very very long time.

What does this say to the families in Mexico, who could have smuggled themselves to the US, but refused to for the sake of their integrity? Yea, aren't they the suckers now?

And what does this say to the millions upon millions of people in the world who are waiting in line for legal immigration? yea fuck you pal.

I'm not even going to go into the fact that CA sales tax is nearly 10% and will be rising to pay for more government handouts.

The only argument they have is that these people have been here for a very long time and that in the future they will contribute to the economy with high paying jobs. Which is true to a certain extent, Yea those same jobs could have been done by citizens if they could be given a chance for a free education too.

I have no problem with allowing these people to get an education, I'm all for it. It's when you place these people before US citizens that rubs me off. They stubbornly pushed themselves on our soil and are now asking us to take car of them.It's not sustainable.

And forget about trying to argue this logic to someone that happens to be an illegal alien from Mexico. No, they insist that we stole their lands and we owe them everything.

It's just not a balanced equation and only encourages more illegals to come here.

So what do we do with the 50 million illegals in this country? I really don't know. But this is going to piss off a lot of people. Bad fucking timing.

UPDATE: Dream act of CALIFORNIA v2 is what I'm pissed at.

Apparently there is two versions of the dream act shit
v.1 . They allow illegals to go to college with their own funds or funding from illegal supporters: (that's cool, I'm not against anyone trying to get edumacated, it might even fund our schools to the point where they open up more sections of each class. A plus for all, and it makes economical sense. If they choose a major that is universal, they can go back to their country of origin and help raise the bar or they can continue pursuing legal status )

v. 2. They allow these illegals to get Financial Aid, Free EDUMACATIONS BABY COME AND GET IT!!! . ( yea fuck that shit. They can get financial aid when they are naturalized citizens, until then they will depend on self funding. )

Simple.
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Last edited by pepperochini; 10-15-2011 at 03:06 PM..
Old 10-15-2011, 02:45 PM pepperochini is offline  
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I have to read up on the CA version cause I'm only familiar with the national DREAM Act. In the meantime, enjoy:


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Old 10-15-2011, 02:56 PM 5ive is offline  
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awesome website
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Old 10-15-2011, 02:56 PM pepperochini is offline  
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pyramid
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in state education is not free. You pay a reduced cost because the state hopes you will stay in the state and use your education to make money and thereby pay taxes in that state, which over a lifetime, will net the state far more in taxes than it ever paid out for your education.

Why are you against the state taking in more money than it puts out?

Also, in no way are these people being "put before american citizens". They only get to pay the same in state tuition rates that citizens of that state would pay. They still have to qualify for the school the same way everyone else does. All they are getting is a chance to participate in the society that they grew up in.

Illegal aliens are a scapegoat for our own bad governance and policies.
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Old 10-15-2011, 02:58 PM pyramid is offline  
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