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Straw Man
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And my head I'd be scratchin' while my thoughts were busy hatchin; If I only had a brain......
 
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Originally Posted by TheMorlock View Post

as far as joe goes. Well people have been praying to Jesus for 2 thousand years and think thats why they scored the touchdown.

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Old 12-04-2011, 05:12 PM Straw Man is offline  
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BlisterDick
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sooo....

how is his dog?
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Old 12-04-2011, 06:29 PM BlisterDick is offline  
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[H]ard|On
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used to.....

Well they do not anymore
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Old 12-05-2011, 03:46 AM [H]ard|On is offline  
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Yes it does something. It has an effect on your nervous system which in turn can turn your body into a repair mode for the system effected. If you look at charts or models of the acupuncture points you will understand how it works with the overlay of the points and of our vascular and nervous system. It has been practiced for many many years into ancient times I believe in china and although it may not be a cure or beneficial for many things it also has a large potential to have some beneficial properties. This especially more so than other aspects of Chinese medicine like those who eat certain animal parts for virility, while some animal parts may have chemicals or hormones that may have effect their potency or effects are so minimal that the hunting of the animals they use for these preparations are not worth killing for the product, especially things like rhinoceros horn which only have value to the men buying them as a snake oil type viagra or to have male offspring or whatever bullshit. I have heard many people say that it has helped them from everything from pain to help quitting cigarette smoking. More research needs to be done.
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Last edited by worldspawn; 12-05-2011 at 04:18 AM..
Old 12-05-2011, 04:12 AM worldspawn is offline  
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Straw Man
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And my head I'd be scratchin' while my thoughts were busy hatchin; If I only had a brain......
 
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sooo....

how is his dog?

Well, the dog is probably drinking a shitload of water
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Old 12-05-2011, 04:30 PM Straw Man is offline  
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Yes it does something. It has an effect on your nervous system which in turn can turn your body into a repair mode for the system effected. If you look at charts or models of the acupuncture points you will understand how it works with the overlay of the points and of our vascular and nervous system. It has been practiced for many many years into ancient times I believe in china and although it may not be a cure or beneficial for many things it also has a large potential to have some beneficial properties. This especially more so than other aspects of Chinese medicine like those who eat certain animal parts for virility, while some animal parts may have chemicals or hormones that may have effect their potency or effects are so minimal that the hunting of the animals they use for these preparations are not worth killing for the product, especially things like rhinoceros horn which only have value to the men buying them as a snake oil type viagra or to have male offspring or whatever bullshit. I have heard many people say that it has helped them from everything from pain to help quitting cigarette smoking. More research needs to be done.

It looks to me like plenty of research has been done, and all of it showed that it pretty much does nothing.
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Old 12-05-2011, 07:55 PM :ninja: is offline  
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mikeawesome
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no its
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Old 12-05-2011, 07:59 PM mikeawesome is offline  
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IcW@teR
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Originally Posted by [H]ard|On View Post
Well they do not anymore

maybe not at your house.
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Old 12-05-2011, 08:09 PM IcW@teR is offline  
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TheMorlock
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It looks to me like plenty of research has been done, and all of it showed that it pretty much does nothing.

and for 20 years they said the same about glucosamine.
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Old 12-05-2011, 11:16 PM TheMorlock is offline  
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My chi is already over level nine thousand, thus acupuncture does zilch.
Old 12-05-2011, 11:29 PM chronage is offline  
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I have been going in for regular acupuncture for a few months now. I'm not necessarily a believer. It is just something I am trying to see if it will do anything.

Thus far my impression of it is that acupuncture itself may not do anything. As in, the insertion of needles to open up energy flows through the body may not actually be doing.

Theres some research that says acupuncture does nothing but I am skeptical of this research because, what was done in the research was they took in patients and then in one group put the needles in the correct spots, then in the other group they put the needles in the incorrect spots. They noted no major difference, and concluded acupuncture is doing nothing. (This was one of the biggest and most authoritative studies on the subject thus far). But yet thousands of people claim acupuncture is wonderful? Whos correct in this instance? I know that most of you wish to fully trust in this concept of 'scientific evidence', so I want to remind you and 'scientific study' doesn't clearly denote any kind of truth ESPECIALLY in the medical field. For a traditional institution of medicine to bone up 1 to 3 million dollars to help discredit a competing field of medicine is no biggie. Not that I am saying this occurred for sure in the acupuncture study in question. Just saying, you do not know if certain research was put up not so much to PROVE something in an honest manner, but rather to discredit something. I suspect this could be occuring with alot of acupuncture research as traditional medicine has assloads of money to put towards clinical studies, whereas acupuncturists not so much money in comparison. One school of thought, one school of medicine can guise themselves as another and do bad research in it's name.

Now with that said, heres the thing that makes me skeptical of the conclusion of that research, acupuncture was clearly doing something over and above doing nothing. And that study only tested for if placement of needles in different locations did something. And perhaps the placement of needles in different locations isnt the controlled variable they should be testing for. Perhaps the benefit of acupuncture has nothing to do with placement of needles in specific areas at all.

This is sort of what I've come to conclude from my experience of actually going through acupuncture.

The standard procedure of acupuncture is this:
1. Talk to acupuncturist about stuff, sensations in body
2. you lay down and the needle you up, from head to toe. Hands, feet, body, head, face. Needles go everywhere, for anything.
3. You then lay there for 30 minutes to an hour, in the dark. Alone. The acupuncturist just leaves you there on the table with all these needles stuck in you. This I did not not know about. I thought you got stuck with needles, then they pull them out a few minutes later. Not the case. You get FILLED with needles and then you must lay there until you fully accept and are comfortable with the needles, in isolation, with your attention fully focused on your needle filled body.

It was after experiencing that third step that it dawned on me why so many people claim acupuncture works. Acupuncture is in essence a very intense focused meditation. I don't think the actual placement of needles does anything in terms of opening up energy channels or whatever. What does something is the intense focused meditative state that is being brought on by being stuck with a bunch of needles, and forced to lay, absolutely still, with your attention fully on your body, for nearly an hour, in dark isolation.

This is another reason why I think that acupuncture study I was talking about is suspicious. It claimed acupuncture does nothing. But acupuncture is an intense focused meditation, and there are MANY studies proving the health benefits of properly practiced meditation.

For me, I do not think I am going to continue going to acupuncture because I am highly proficient at meditation by myself, and I don't need acupuncture to coerce me into such mental states. But for many many people that is not the case.

It occured to me that going through acupuncture is the only time most people will ever get close to actually meditating properly. Most people cannot sit in a pitch black room, absolutely motionless for more than like 30 seconds. Seriously, go try it yourself. Go in a room which you cut off all light to, and sit down on the floor. And don't move a single muscle. See how long you can last doing that. Most people I don't think make it past 30 seconds. If you try REALLY hard you might make it to 5 or 10 minutes without moving a SINGLE muscle or batting a single eyelid. But to last an hour in that state?

The vast majority will never be able to do that.

That is unless they have a needle stuck in them every which way creating an actual physical sensation to make them not move any single muscle. It's on that principle that I think so many people find benefit in acupuncture. It forces you to remain ABSOLUTELY still and motionless for an hour. And it clears your mind and focuses your mind entirely on your body ( an absolute necessity to proper meditation ), all your daily worries and racing thoughts just fade away when you got 50 needles stuck in you head to toe and then your mind is fully focused 100% on your body and all these needles stuck in it. You are essentially forced to lay they, in pitch black, in completely unwaivering focus on your body, absolutely motionless from head to toe, for an hour. That is what real meditation is, and that is what acunpuncture forces people to do. Thats why I think so many people find benefit in acupuncture. And thats why I am highly skeptical of studies claiming to say 'acupuncture does nothing', because acupuncture is deep meditation, and deep meditation already is proven effective in many ways.

However with all that said. I think if you can induce a deep meditative state yourself, as in lay in pitch black, absolutely motionless with your attention 100% focused on your body and free of mind chatter. You are essentially doing anything and everything acupuncture could do for you. But you know, you probably can't do that, and you probably would find acupuncture ( deep meditation ) to help you in some way.
Old 02-23-2012, 10:46 PM dio is offline  
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Straw Man
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tddr motherfucker

(d is for dumb)
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Old 02-24-2012, 05:22 AM Straw Man is offline  
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AllUranusBelong2Me!
 
A chiropractor f'upped my neck and I was on pain meds for about a week. Accupuncture helped me get off them. I'm not into holistic BS either. I'm sure it works for some and not for others.
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Old 02-26-2012, 10:05 AM AllUranusBelong2Me! is offline  
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[H]ard|On
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A chiropractor f'upped my neck and I was on pain meds for about a week. Accupuncture helped me get off them. I'm not into holistic BS either. I'm sure it works for some and not for others.

That or your neck healed after a week
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:27 PM [H]ard|On is offline  
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:ninja:
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snip

So it's placebo at best. You could meditate on your own without paying some quack a few hundred clams to stick needles in your skin.

My girlfriend was actually referred to acupuncture "therapy" by her GP for anxiety. It did nothing, and when she told her anxiety coach his reaction was basically, "YOU DON'T SAY?!"
If people want to believe in stupid shit, that's fine. But when you start telling other people about how wonderful your stupid shit is, or force your stupid shit upon your animals (there are several doggy acupuncture "specialists" in my city...) then you can prompty go fuck yourself.
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Old 02-26-2012, 01:46 PM :ninja: is offline  
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