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5ive
 
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No one's saying socialism doesn't do the same....
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Old 03-11-2012, 10:46 AM 5ive is offline  
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joemama
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Originally Posted by 5ive View Post
Read King Leopold's Ghost to learn about Belgium's involvement in the Congo. Roughly 10 million people died. I'm pretty sure you can attribute roughly the same if not more deaths to capitalism than communism.

Not saying that communism is superior or anything, but there is plenty of blood on the hands of capitalists
I don't live in Belgium or have any ties to the country...what's your point? Also, did the Belgians directly kill that many Congolese people?
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Old 03-11-2012, 10:55 AM joemama is offline  
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5ive
 
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It was right off the top of my head. And it depends on what you mean by directly. Not all were by direct Belgian hand (as in execution), but all deaths were attributable to Belgian policies - especially the forced labor system.
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Old 03-11-2012, 11:00 AM 5ive is offline  
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TheMorlock
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I don't live in Belgium or have any ties to the country...what's your point? Also, did the Belgians directly kill that many Congolese people?

force fed them and they got heart attacks and died.
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Old 03-11-2012, 11:03 AM TheMorlock is offline  
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Straw Man
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The dipshit factor is strong.







Are you fucking kidding? It's straight out of the social sciences. Human beings can relate directly and give a shit about only so many people. For the really highly social people they can relate to about 30 people max. Most cant get over 10, and your aspie ass probably cant even relate well to one. With no direct sympathy for more than that most "Everybody Is Totaly Equal and deserve the Same Exact Slice of The Pie" systems break down starting at 50 people Anyone outside your immediate circle of friends is considered OTHER and others just dont deserve as much as they are getting so we will just take that tiny bit more than we let them have.

Your dipshit factor is off the charts.

hahaha i get it dipshit factor was such a funny utterance it's tautological hehe u so funny

you really didn't say anything of any worth (as usual) so I'll just skip it, lol
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Old 03-11-2012, 12:10 PM Straw Man is offline  
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You can discount human nature all you want, but people who don't have blinders on know that it really has an effect on society no matter what system is in use....and other than some dictatorships, there is no purely evil form of government, as well as none that are purely benevolent to all people. Since you seem to know so much about it...how would you define communism?
We have these things called laws for those things. Why are you asking me to define you something which you categorically deny regardless of what is said, before and after dismissing the idea?
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Also, what is dumb about what I said? My earliest ancestor in the new world (pre-revolution) was a lowly Irish deckhand on a merchant ship...and my mom's side also Irish and fleeing the potato famine (British) in the 19th century. Neither side came over with wealth or status.....yet today the families are full of doctors, lawyers, CPA's, small business owners and others that make a comfortable living and now have a bit of status in their communities. Do you think if my ancestors could see what they started they would think that coming to the new world (with opportunities they didn't have at home) was a "dumb" idea? Capitalism is far from a perfect system, but it DOES create opportunities for those that really want it..
Now you're just being themorlock and wanting some hero medal for your ancestry. A fraction might make it. I guess a fraction can be the friend of a dictator too, are you going to praise nepotism next?
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Old 03-11-2012, 12:14 PM Straw Man is offline  
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Oh and 5ive is absolutely right about the belgian congo, and that's just for starters.

It's hilarious how people remember to credit every fucking famine there ever was to the filthy communists when famines are actual occurances of nature as well (this of course excludes things like the holodomor and the chinese experiments). All this, while willfully being ignorant of hundreds of years of downright genocide for profit.
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Old 03-11-2012, 12:17 PM Straw Man is offline  
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joemama
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We have these things called laws for those things. Why are you asking me to define you something which you categorically deny regardless of what is said, before and after dismissing the idea?

Now you're just being themorlock and wanting some hero medal for your ancestry. A fraction might make it. I guess a fraction can be the friend of a dictator too, are you going to praise nepotism next?
Here are the facts...choose to ignore them if you like.

Even the poor people in the U.S. (under a form of capitalism) are still better off than their counterparts in many countries. Even the lowest of the low (living on the streets) have options for food and shelter if they really want it.....but a surprisingly large number of them choose to live that way and actively resist anything other than basic food to keep them alive another day.

Also, what exactly do you think I'm denying? My family isn't a rare case, there are those who came here seeking a better life and didn't find it...but many more that did eventually.
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Old 03-11-2012, 12:21 PM joemama is offline  
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joemama
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Oh and 5ive is absolutely right about the belgian congo, and that's just for starters.

It's hilarious how people remember to credit every fucking famine there ever was to the filthy communists when famines are actual occurances of nature as well (this of course excludes things like the holodomor and the chinese experiments). All this, while willfully being ignorant of hundreds of years of downright genocide for profit.
Once again, I'm not Belgian...are you? I think of Belgium as France Lite anyway..or at least they have been that way since I've been alive. So you're trying to say that Imperialism is the same as Capitalism?
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Old 03-11-2012, 12:27 PM joemama is offline  
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TheMorlock
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How many wookies died to go into making Dumbho's arguments?
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Old 03-11-2012, 12:28 PM TheMorlock is offline  
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Once again, I'm not Belgian...are you? I think of Belgium as France Lite anyway..or at least they have been that way since I've been alive. So you're trying to say that Imperialism is the same as Capitalism?

lol
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Old 03-11-2012, 12:32 PM Straw Man is offline  
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How many wookies died to go into making Dumbho's arguments?

how many appletinis got into your head before you became a useless trainwreck of a human being
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Old 03-11-2012, 12:33 PM Straw Man is offline  
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joemama
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lol
So you have no reply to that eh? That sort of imperialism was over by the early 20th century and barely hanging on then.....and in any case it was over before even my grandparents were born. I never said that Imperialism was ok while Communism is bad...I don't know where you're getting that from. Maybe the voices in your head?
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Old 03-11-2012, 12:39 PM joemama is offline  
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TheMorlock
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He never does.
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Old 03-11-2012, 02:44 PM TheMorlock is offline  
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So, capitalism IS colonialism/imperialism
No? Capitalism is an economic system, it's not intrinsically tied to colonialism or imperialism. The Soviets were imperialist as hell and I certainly wouldn't say that communism is automatically imperialist.

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and you find this to be most utilitarian?
Are there any options that have a demonstrated case better than capitalism? There are certainly systemic improvements that could be made, exploiting the undeveloped world less high among them, but I've never seen anything that would lead me to think anything else could replace the base tenants of capitalism and be effective.
Old 03-11-2012, 03:29 PM Gibonius is offline  
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