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pyramid
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The fallacy to your fallacy is that illegal drugs are available everywhere despite being illegal. You can get drugs in prison. If we can't keep drugs out of prison, what fucking hope do we ever have of keeping them out of our country?

The second fallacy is that everyone would go out and do hard drugs just because they are legal. Pretty much everyone who is actually interested in doing hard drugs is already doing them.

I think if we legalize weed first and then spend a few years debating the rest of it, it will almost be a moot point. In the netherlands weed has been openly sold and used since 1976. What has that resulted in other than a lot of drug tourism? Well, the people who actually live there use weed at half the rate that we do, both adults and kids, and since they semi-legalized weed their rates of use for harder drugs have dropped to tiny fractions of what our rates of use are.
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Old 07-12-2012, 08:30 PM pyramid is offline  
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Seems to work just fine with alcohol and tobacco which kill like 50x the number of people illegal drugs do each year.

I'm all for them doing what they have done with cigarettes and using the tax money they get from those products to inform people of their dangers and dissuade people from doing them.

Issue with herbs like pot, is where there have been mandatory minimum sentences for possessing it; Quite possibly lightened up a bit over the years, but at one point it was making prices for it spike pretty heavily, and hard to get-Meanwhile making cocaine, heroin, and crack cheaper and easier to get...

For those "RA RA RA SUPPORT TEH DRUG WARZ LETS GO LOLOL" crowd, that might also happen to have kids that they're supposedly protecting...

IS THIS WISE?

Good god. Be serious.
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Old 07-12-2012, 08:31 PM Killer_B is offline  
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pyramid
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i was referring to damage to oneself, not society as a whole

Alcohol still ranks high on the list if you change the parameters to self harm. But that should be less important to policy makers than harms to society. If you include alcohol and tobacco with all the other legal and illegal drug deaths, alcohol and tobacco account for 95% of all drug deaths in the United States.

If you want to harm yourself, that is your god given right according to the foundation of our nation. The law is only supposed to step in where you harm or create the potential to harm others. For example: you can drink all the fucking beer you want. That's totally legal as long as you are just harming yourself. But if you get in a car and drive while intoxicated, even if you don't hit anyone, then it's a crime.
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Last edited by pyramid; 07-12-2012 at 08:41 PM..
Old 07-12-2012, 08:36 PM pyramid is offline  
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pyramid
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Originally Posted by Killer_B View Post
Issue with herbs like pot, is where there have been mandatory minimum sentences for possessing it; Quite possibly lightened up a bit over the years, but at one point it was making prices for it spike pretty heavily, and hard to get-Meanwhile making cocaine, heroin, and crack cheaper and easier to get...

For those "RA RA RA SUPPORT TEH DRUG WARZ LETS GO LOLOL" crowd, that might also happen to have kids that they're supposedly protecting...

IS THIS WISE?

Good god. Be serious.

Also drug testing. Why use weed when you can get busted for it weeks after use when you can use something even harder that will be totally gone and unable to be tested for after 72 hours.

Almost everything about the drug war is a giant case of unintended consequences.
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Old 07-12-2012, 08:38 PM pyramid is offline  
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The fallacy to your fallacy is that illegal drugs are available everywhere despite being illegal. You can get drugs in prison. If we can't keep drugs out of prison, what fucking hope do we ever have of keeping them out of our country?

The second fallacy is that everyone would go out and do hard drugs just because they are legal. Pretty much everyone who is actually interested in doing hard drugs is already doing them.

I think if we legalize weed first and then spend a few years debating the rest of it, it will almost be a moot point. In the netherlands weed has been openly sold and used since 1976. What has that resulted in other than a lot of drug tourism? Well, the people who actually live there use weed at half the rate that we do, both adults and kids, and since they semi-legalized weed their rates of use for harder drugs have dropped to tiny fractions of what our rates of use are.
So you're saying that you personally know just as many people who have tried coke, heroin, meth etc...(and know where to get it) as people who have tried alcohol? If we try to put ALL drugs on the same level...or even on the same level as alcohol/tobacco....are we saying it should be sold at 7/11 along with the legal drugs and let minimum wage clerks be in charge? Or do we lump it all together and have your beer and cigs only sold through government dispensaries along with your FDA approved heroin injection..
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Old 07-12-2012, 08:49 PM joemama is offline  
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Old 07-12-2012, 08:53 PM DarkHelmet is offline  
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Old 07-12-2012, 08:55 PM DarkHelmet is offline  
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Old 07-12-2012, 08:58 PM DarkHelmet is offline  
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Old 07-12-2012, 08:59 PM BlisterDick is offline  
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Old 07-12-2012, 09:00 PM DarkHelmet is offline  
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Old 07-12-2012, 09:01 PM DarkHelmet is offline  
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Old 07-12-2012, 09:03 PM DarkHelmet is offline  
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Old 07-12-2012, 09:04 PM DarkHelmet is offline  
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pyramid
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So you're saying that you personally know just as many people who have tried coke, heroin, meth etc...(and know where to get it) as people who have tried alcohol? If we try to put ALL drugs on the same level...or even on the same level as alcohol/tobacco....are we saying it should be sold at 7/11 along with the legal drugs and let minimum wage clerks be in charge? Or do we lump it all together and have your beer and cigs only sold through government dispensaries along with your FDA approved heroin injection..

That's not what I said at all. There will never be as many people who have tried illegal hard drugs as alcohol. Hard drugs do not appeal to everyone. If they are made legal that is not going to change. The people who do hard drugs don't care about their legality and as such, they are already doing their hard drugs. The people who don't do hard drugs don't care that they are illegal, they aren't interested in doing them. You don't just randomly decide to get an 8 ball of coke if you've never done it before.

I would put hard drugs in their own stores, not in 7/11. I would put weed in it's own store too like the netherlands and the marijuana dispensaries in CA do. All they sell is weed and nothing else. You want to separate hard drugs from the soft drugs. I don't think there is anything wrong with the way alcohol and tobacco are sold now.
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Old 07-12-2012, 09:05 PM pyramid is offline  
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Old 07-12-2012, 09:05 PM DarkHelmet is offline  
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