If we stopped wars, we'd have enough money to make paradise.

[Kahnza]

Originally Posted by pyramid

We were the gods of the world after WW2. We could have done whatever we wanted and we did.

If we had chosen to help everyone else in the world develop their agriculture and infrastructure as opposed to spending trillions on weapons systems which have largely gone unused, the world would be a very different, better place today.

no doubt

[Kahnza]

Originally Posted by pyramid

Our founding fathers never intended for us to even have standing armies. If the could see how we have squandered our immense wealth, they would be sick.

mmmhmmm

[dio]

Originally Posted by Kahnza

Changing the entire planet like that would take a VERY long time. And many people will be against it and fight it. Those things are great in theory. But to get a vast majority of people to all work together to achieve it is virtually impossible.

Terence McKenna, a firm believer in the transformation of 2012 once said that, what he thinks is going to come to happen in 2012 is simply 'art will get teeth'. Meaning art will reach a level of power that everything can be recreated with it.

You also must understand an additional context to that, in that Mckenna has sees art, or 'magick' (same thing in this context), as being the prime weapon against monotheistic control structures (religion), that inherently manifest a dualistic paradigm and resultingly cause people to believe fighting is necessary.

So to say 'art will get teeth', means, the effort to decondition humanity from duality for all the past thousands of years through what is modern day 'art', and what in the past was 'magick', simply means 2012 is a culmination point when a thousand year effort may reach a benchmark.

Mckenna didn't live long enough to see the state of the world today, but my interpretation of his instinct, and that statement, is that he sensed the coming interactive technology. Interactive gaming. It is through this technology that art is getting teeth.

Think about how in the 1800's, if an artist wanted to create something to try to cause a social change, to impact someone. They made a poster, they made a painting, a pamphlet. They would post it on a wall. They could hope, enough people walking by, enough artists making art, this would cause social change. But still no matter how many posters you have, how many paintings, this art is still very passive. Or you could a traveling story teller, or theatre show, entertain people for a few hours. Still that is very passive.

Go forward on the timeline a little to the 1970's where personal audio players were now standard. People could walk around, engrossed in music, they could essentially live in the artwork of musicians. It is really on this principle that I believe so much social change happened in the 1970's. The movement was largely led by musicians, and musicians could have such a magickal force on culture as a whole (remember magick / art are the same thing in this context), musicians could have such a hold on society because due to the prevelance of portable audio technology being so cheap, and everywhere. People could always constantly live in the art created by the musicians of the time, and because of this it rearranged the brain of so many people. In a true traditional sense, magick is willed brain change, thats why art with the intent to change society is magick. Interestingly many major bands of the era (The Beattles, Led Zeppelin) in one way or another, do pay homage to Aleister Crowley, a major proprietor of magick at the turn of the last century.

Art began to get teeth in the 1970's you could say...

but in 2012, now. With the fact that everyones portable media device doesn't just play music, but is completely integrated into their life, into their friends, into their way of thinking, and is a highly capable 3D accelerated interactive device. The potential for it to be used as a magickal force is seriously off the charts. You can completely recondition culture with this level of engrossing technology, more so than John Lennon or anyone ever could before. If John Lennon was alive today ( or any major non-dualistic force) , and was leading a mobile game development studio, we probably wouldn't even be having this conversation because it'd be well on it's way to being done. If he could get that much done with just music, and people playing 3 to 4 minute recordings over speakers. Imagine how much impact he would of had if people were staring at screens, completely hypnotized and engrossed in them, with more sensse being stimulated, for hours and hours on end playing some sort of game, or involved in some interactive something, that was completely magickally charged for the rearrangement of someones brain. This technology is really being wasted on shit like 'modern warfare' and 'zooville' and 'world of warcraft'. Although world of warcraft does have some interesting magickal components put in it, but I think it's more detrimental than helpful.

So anyways, discuss this thread topic with me so I can attempt to devise magickal structures that can be implemented into a multi-touch mobile device to recondition your brain. The great work will be completed, we are so very close.

[dio]

Originally Posted by pyramid

It's too unrealistic because we are too filled with hate and nationalism and greed and other which gets in the way of seeing the truth.

yes I guess this is really the core of the thing...

also in connection to my post above, and in relation to what you just said, katamari damacy was a brilliant magickal structure. Kids who grew up playing that game for hours and hours are probably much less prone to dualistic thinking.

[pyramid]

ugh, god fucking dammit.

you lost me at terence mckenna and I'm one of the few people who even knows who he is.

why did you have to go from a good idea to full on retard?

[pyramid]

son of a bitch.

[dio]

Originally Posted by pyramid

Our founding fathers never intended for us to even have standing armies. If they could see how we have squandered our immense wealth, they would be sick.

fund my mobile magickal game development studio with your parents massive funds and lets attempt to correct this

[pyramid]

you suck, I'm going to go eat ice cream.

[dio]

Originally Posted by pyramid

ugh, god fucking dammit.

you lost me at terence mckenna and I'm one of the few people who even knows who he is.

why did you have to go from a good idea to full on retard?

the context I presented needs to be understood

You must understand that I run on a mode of thinking called contextual logic, or maybe logic. Nothing I say is true, and nothing I say I actually believe. They are just varying degrees of probability of likelihood.

You don't let a context run through your brain because it is TRUE, and intended to override anything else. You let it run through brain as almost like an exercise in letting your brain synapses move around in ways they previously would not have, so that at some point in the future your brains synapses may produce something that could be something worthwhile enough to override prior brain structures.

It is not the strongest species that survives, it is the most adaptable. To be adaptable you need to be dynamic, and to be dynamic you need things that force yourself into different modalities. This is what I am doing.

[dio]

Originally Posted by pyramid

you suck, I'm going to go eat ice cream.

and then masturbate alone in your mansion ?

You know you originally convinced me I should smoke weed.

In a way I wouldn't be thinking like this if it weren't for you.

KARMA BITCHES

[pyramid]

Originally Posted by dio

and then masturbate alone in your mansion ?

[dio]

You know what the argument was actually so convincing I have had it saved to a text file for all theses years:

**Free_Willy:
In the 2000 campaign for president, George W. Bush said that the federal government should not interfere with the medical marijuana policies of the several states. Like so many other promises, he went back on his word and has closed down medical marijuana facilities permitted by state governments.

This is an outrage. The federal government has no constitutional authority to interfere with state drug policies. When the federal government outlawed alcohol, it required a constitutional amendment to do so. Nonetheless it has assumed the legal authority to wage its "War on Drugs."

According to nearly every scientific study on the subject, including ones conducted by the government, medical marijuana provides unique relief to patients suffering from cancer, AIDS, glaucoma and other illnesses, and the drug does not have the same addictive properties as alcohol.

The federally approved Marinol contains the psychoactive THC but lacks other cannabinoids crucial to marijuana as an effective medicine. This is one of the many insanities of federal drug policy, which categorizes a plant that has never been shown to kill anyone as more illegal than cocaine, and certainly more illegal than alcohol.

Though smoking marijuana just as smoking tobacco can cause harm to the lungs and respiratory system, the drug can also be ingested and vaporized so as to prevent such unwanted side effects.

On a fundamental level, Libertarians believe that it is the unalienable and constitutional right of individuals to medicate themselves and choose for themselves what to put into their bodies, as long as they live up to the consequences of their actions. The federal government has no proper say in the matter, and state governments violate the rights of the people in their own attempts to enforce morality. The decision to ingest, smoke or consume any drug should be up to the individual, under the advice of his or her physician, when appropriate. Locking people up for trying to relieve their pain is cruel and unusual punishment for an act that hurts no one.

The Drug War has led to some of the worst violations of the constitutional liberties of Americans, as well as to the worst wave of violent crime in American history since Alcohol Prohibition. It has been used to rationalize unlawful searches and seizures, corruption of the court system, no-knock raids, racial profiling, and "civil asset forfeiture" a policy whereby government officials can confiscate private property without even charging anyone with a crime. The War on Drugs, more than anything else, has served as a means of destroying the Bill of Rights. It has also led to excessive taxes and spending, costing more than 40 billion dollars a year to arrest, prosecute and imprison non-violent drug offenders.

Drug Prohibition has caused gang warfare and other violent crime by raising the prices of drugs so much that vicious criminals enter the market to make astronomical profits, and addicts rob and steal to get money to pay the inflated prices for their drugs. On average, drug prisoners spend more time in federal prison than rapists, who often get out on early release because of the over-crowding in prison caused by the Drug War. While violent criminals can usually have their sentences reduced, drug offenders are subject to "mandatory minimums," which strip away judicial discretion and force judges to put users and dealers in prison for decades. This has to stop.

The Drug War also has funded terrorists; providing them with opportunities for enormous profits, and even by giving foreign aid to such regimes as the Taliban as long as they promised to have "tough drug" policies.

The Drug War does not curb demand, it barely reduces supply, however it makes America much more dangerous and much less free.

A Libertarian president would order federal officials to cease and desist in harassing medical marijuana patients and would block federal spending on the War on Drugs. Nonviolent drug offenders would be released from federal prison, and each state would choose its own drug policy, just as each chose its own alcohol policy when alcohol Prohibition was repealed. Libertarians would hope and expect most states to come around and severely reform their policies to make them more humane and less at odds with the Constitution and the American way of life.







**Other Poster:
"marijuana provides unique relief to patients suffering from cancer, AIDS, glaucoma and other illnesses, and the drug does not have the same addictive properties as alcohol."

i read as far as here. what studies are you refering too? i know of none seeing as the drug is illegal thus unable to used for testing. i did however read some anti-drug literature that mentioned that at best, it offers no more comfort than placebo... again, in lack of legal sanctioned testing, i can't confirm...


**Pyramid:
There have been thousands of sanctioned reports and certified studies on marijuana. It is probably one of the most studied plants in the history of mankind.

Here's a couple recent ones from the Institute of Medecine:
http://bob.nap.edu/books/0309071550/html/
http://search.nap.edu/books/0309065313/html/

Here is a company in the UK that is making cannabinoid medecines from marijuana plant extracts: www.gwpharm.com

Here is their product pipeline: http://www.gwpharm.com/research_pipeline.asp

Certain cannabinoids have neuroprotective qualities: http://www.pyramid-tech.net/media/Neuroprotective.wmv
http://www.gwpharm.com/research_neuroprotection.asp

Cannabis can help MS sufferers and reduces pain associated with certain kinds of nerve and spinal cord damage and may even bring relief to phantom limb pain:
http://www.newscientist.com/hottopi.../cannabisms.jsp
http://www.newscientist.com/hottopi...a/milestone.jsp
http://www.gwpharm.com/research_multiple_sclerosis.asp
http://www.gwpharm.com/research_spinal.asp
http://www.gwpharm.com/research_phantom.asp

Cannabinoids have been shown to have antitumor abilities:
http://www.gwpharm.com/research_anti-tumour.asp
http://www.brainlife.org/integrativ...si_20040301.htm
http://www.letfreedomgrow.com/cmu/c...nd_lymphoma.htm
http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/cgi/c.../full/308/3/838

They are helpful with AIDS wasting syndrome and appetite stimulation:
http://www.gwpharm.com/research_aids.asp
http://www.gwpharm.com/research_appetite.asp
http://www.aids.org/atn/a-319-06.html

Cannabinoids may even be useful in drug rehabilitation:
http://www.gwpharm.com/research_withdrawel.asp




**Other Poster:
Originally Posted by Jynus
oh ya, so if we legalize drugs, all the criminals will stop doing crime? lets legalize everything, then we won't have any criminals anymore!!!!! hmm, interesting concep..


**Pyramid:
The prohibition of drugs causes crime, and not just in that it criminalizes drug use. It creates a whole new set of problems and does little to nothing to solve the problem it was supposedly originally created to solve, drug abuse.

http://www.csdp.org/edcs/ Click all the links, it is a complete presentation.
http://www.nap.edu/books/0309072735/html/




**Other Poster:
Yeah, here's a rebuttal: where are all of the sources for this information (misinformation?)?


**Pyramid:
Read a government report or three: http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/index.htm




**Other Poster:
again, ANY tax revenue will far be outweighed by the extreme society cost from unproductiviety and heath care costs... compare any stat on tax revenue from alcohal and tobacco to the health costs from it...


**Pyramid:
You are also comparing two of the biggest killers and causes of medical problems, accidents, and violence to marijuana which is not even statistically associated with death: http://www.aegis.com/news/bw/1997/BW970515.html

You are also assuming that the only thing stopping the majority of people from doing dangerous drugs is their legality. Is the only thing stopping you from smoking crack all day the legality? Alcohol is legal and yet most people do not spend all day drinking it. Why is that? Perhaps because there are other things that influence someones decision to do something other than legality.

Look at the societal costs of overeating and underexercising. They will soon outweigh (no pun intended) alcohol and tobacco combined but no one is calling for banning fast food and instituting mandatory exercise. That is the beauty of freedom and everyone should be allowed to enjoy it. No one expects the tax revenues of alcohol and tobacco to outpace their cost to society and no one should go to jail because their drug of choice doesn't meet that standard either. Marijuana would come a lot closer to meeting that standard than alcohol or tobacco could anyway. Also, I thought smokers saved money for the healthy people because they pay taxes and pay into social security but they die off earlier meaning they don't take as much money out of the system. Healthy people who drag on forever are more expensive.

What are the societal costs of wasting billions of dollars annually to arrest and jail people for being unhealthy? How much does it cost america to be wasting our time arresting 750,000 people a year for smoking pot? Do you realize how many billions of law enforcement man hours that represents that would be better spent protecting us from actual crime? Do you think a system designed to prohibit unhealthy food and a lack of exercise by arresting and imprisoning violaters would cost more or less than it costs us to just let the people who choose to be unhealthy be unhealthy?




**Other Poster:
yup, exactly what i'm saying. sweden legalized perscription amphetamines in 1965. speed addiction rose 88% after the first year. china legalized opium early this century, 90million new addicts arose. England tried controll distruibution of heroin during the early 60's, heroin addict numbers doubled every 16 months till they stopped... what you're forgetting is unlike alcohal for the most part, this shit is addictive...


**Pyramid:
We have legal prescription amphetamines and stimulants now. What do you think ritalin and other ADD drugs are? We feed them to kids like candy. People also like their uppers. Just look at the use of caffiene and other stimulants. The swiss have a heroin maintenance program that has been declared a success.
http://www.csdp.org/ads/swiss.htm
http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer...es/OVERALLS.htm

Opium was legal in china but in 1800 its import was banned. Many countries, including our own, found that it was very profitable to trade in banned items and continued to supply the chinese with opium. http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/heroin/opiwar1.htm

Our prohibition is what makes cocaine so profitable to southern american cartels and our prohibition is what makes herion so profitable for terrorists. Our prohibition is what makes marijuana worth more than gold ounce for ounce and what makes it possible for the sale of marijuana and other illicit drugs to fund terrorists and terrible things all over the world. Prohibition is what funds organized crime and is what has made it rich and powerful.

All Drugs were also legal in this country for most of our history. The prohibition of alcohol proved to be a failure so it was abandoned. The prohibition of drugs has been a failure because despite our prohibition anything you could want to do is available right now somewhere in your town and thanks to prohibition the best place to look is probably the local highschool or college. http://www.pyramid-tech.net/images/lifetimeuse.png

Alcohol is sold in stores where ID is checked. Drugs are sold in schools where ID is not necessary. Ah, the beauty of prohibition.

Despite this most people think it is a good idea because the government has consistently obscured the truth in this debate right from the begining. It is in their interests to continue the war on drugs. If you look at the original reasons we started the prohibition of drugs the justification was all based upon lies and mass hysteria that was generated just to support the prohibition by the same people who were put out of a job by the end of alcohol prohibition. Don't think it is a coincidence that the end of alcohol prohibition and the begining of drug prohibition is only seperated by a few years.

If you are not a teal dear kind of person this is a very good read on the beginings of our drug policy: http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/History/whiteb1.htm

Also, alcohol is not as benign as you seem to think it is compared to other drugs:
http://www.pyramid-tech.net/images/d...properties.gif

Severe alcohol withdrawal is worse than heroin withdrawal and has even been known to be fatal.




**Other Poster:
food is required to live, how can u ban it? drugs meanwhile serve no useful purpose to survival... and manditory exercise is becoming a required component of most schools. plus in some countries like germany for example, they don't have appearance discrimination laws and your appearance is a determining factor in your hiring sucess, so there is a benifit in looking healthy...


**Pyramid:
I said ban unhealthy food and arrest people for being fat. Unhealthy food serves no purpose other than tasting good and you don't need enjoyment to survive so you should be happy with your nutritional gruel. You don't need anything you do just for fun so you shouldn't miss any of it when it is gone.




**Other Poster:
i agree. like i said, if yer caught with drugs, it's into the military u go... as for the saving money argument, i can't see it. doesn't any pension and social security u get go 2 your next of kin? i duno, i'm not old yet...


**Pyramid:
Why would someone have to go into the military? They shouldn't go to jail but they should be forced into military service? That is laughable. Why do you think the military would want to be a repository for drug users?

Social security is what everyone pays into to live off of when they are retired or if they are disabled. I don't think it is transferable. A pension is different. That is through your employer.




**Other Poster:
for pot, yes i can see... i'm arguing more from a crack / meth standpoint... and i still say, don't put the users in jail, send em to the military!!! let the pushers and growers rot in jail for life, but not the users...


**Pyramid:
How are people who smoke pot supposed to do that if all the growers are in jail for life and why would growers need to go to jail for life if smoking weed isn't so bad? Is growing a plant really something that someone should be put in jail for at all, let alone for life? Also drug dealers aren't all "pushers". That is what they tell little kids in DARE. Drugs sell themselves. You don't have to push them on anyone, people willingly buy them of their own free will.




**Other Poster:
hmm, i argue drugs the same way i argue murder. it's bad for society as a whole, thus society should have the state put somethign into place to protect society from itself... it's not freedom limiting. hell, it's more freedom liberating than anything. u don't have to worry about being under the control of narcotics and free to live your life...


**Pyramid:
I'm sure all the people who have been seperated from their property, family, and freedom for the crime of getting high feel really liberated.

Your idea of freedom is very different than mine.

[pyramid]

I do like to argue.



<3

[dio]

Originally Posted by pyramid

I do like to argue.



<3

While on this subject, and also slightly off subject. Have you put money in GWPharma?

[pyramid]

Nope.